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ABA Law Student Podcast

English, Education, 1 season, 107 episodes, 2 days, 10 hours, 4 minutes
About
Presented by the American Bar Association’s Law Student Division, the ABA Law Student Podcast covers issues that affect law students, law schools, and recent grads. From finals and graduation to the bar exam and finding a job, this show is your trusted resource for the next big step.
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What Are the Limits of Students’ First Amendment Rights on College Campuses?

Recent protests at universities across the country pushed the boundaries of free speech, and outcomes for protestors were varied, to say the least. The world of academia encourages the free exchange of ideas, but some protest actions prompted police involvement, disciplinary action by universities, student expulsions, and even the loss of career opportunities for graduates. As a law student, what do you need to understand about these events as interpreted through our existing legal frameworks? Professor Roy Gutterman joins Chay, Leah, and Professor Berger to offer his expertise on First Amendment rights and the interplay of civil protests and the law.
6/10/202437 minutes, 41 seconds
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Collaborative Impact: Working Together to Change the World

Many young law students begin their studies with high hopes of generating change by becoming a lawyer and advocate, but what does this lofty dream look like in the real world? Leah Haberman talks with Professor Dorothy Roberts about her career as a lawyer, professor, author, and activist. Professor Roberts shares how her unique skills led her to leverage her curiosity and passions to become an expert on racial interconnections and tensions in many legal issues, particularly those involving reproductive injustices and child welfare. She shares many tips for law students on how to bring focus to their strengths and interests, embrace collaboration, and make small but meaningful changes in the world; one day at a time. Dorothy Roberts is the 14th Penn Integrates Knowledge Professor, the George A. Weiss University Professor of Law & Sociology, and the Raymond Pace & Sadie Tanner Mossell Alexander Professor of Civil Rights at University of Pennsylvania.
4/15/202447 minutes, 54 seconds
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Plan to Pivot: Embracing Change in Law School and Beyond

Many law students begin their studies thinking they have their legal ambitions all mapped out, only to realize later that their perfect plan is no longer what they want. Having this type of identity crisis in law school isn’t a bad thing, and if it happens to you, don’t panic! Law school and your early legal career should be a time for exploration and change. Chay Rodriguez talks with attorney Katie Winchenbach about her personal experiences and the strategies, resources, and connections that helped her pivot to new opportunities both as a student and a young lawyer.  Katie Winchenbach is a corporate attorney at Motorola Solutions and program director for Ms. JD, a national nonprofit that supports aspiring and early-career women attorneys.
3/18/202445 minutes, 54 seconds
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The Merits Of Being A Little Reckless: How An Arts Lawyer Took On The Sackler Family

Becoming a specialist in a niche area of the law is often touted as the most effective path for attorneys, but there’s definitely much to be said for having a more dynamic approach to your future legal career. As an attorney, you may end up with a client whose needs stretch across multiple areas of the law, and being willing to learn and develop new areas of expertise are essential in those situations.  Leah Haberman interviews Michael Quinn about his experiences representing clients in the fight against the Sackler Family and Purdue Pharma—which both bore heavy responsibility for the opioid crisis. Michael, an arts lawyer, discusses his involvement in this highly publicized case and how his flexible approach to his own legal practice led him to navigate multiple areas of the law to fight for his clients.  Michael Quinn is a partner at Eisenberg & Baum, LLP, where he heads the firm’s Arts & Culture Practice Group. 
2/12/202443 minutes, 6 seconds
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The Art of Negotiation: Understanding the Nuance and Skill of Advocacy

Labor issues captured the headlines throughout much of 2023, with over 400 strikes involving half a million workers. From a legal perspective, there’s a lot to unpack about negotiation tactics, advances in labor and employment law, impacts on basic human rights, and effective ways to fight for fair outcomes in legal matters. In this edition of the ABA Law Student Podcast, former professional soccer player and now attorney Meghann Burke talks about her experiences while leading the National Women’s Soccer League Players Association to its first collective bargaining agreement in 2022. Looking at both employment and a wider range of advocacy issues, this episode explores the value of creative negotiation skills in the life of a lawyer.  Meghann Burke is an attorney and executive director of the National Women’s Soccer League Players Association. 
1/8/202446 minutes, 2 seconds
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Engaging with AI in Your Future Legal Career

There’s no way to take a pass on tech competence. In your future as a lawyer, you have an ethical responsibility to understand and use technology in your practice, and today’s fastest growing tech is AI. Whether you’re an AI fan or perhaps a little scared of a robot takeover, this podcast will help you understand many of the latest AI trends and their impacts in the legal world.  Leah Haberman interviews Professor Orly Lobel, author of “The Equality Machine: Harnessing Tomorrow’s Technologies for a Brighter, More Inclusive Future”, to discuss AI, algorithms, current tools, and how to make sense of them all. There are and always will be positive and negative implications for AI uses, and our goal should be to use it for good.  Orly Lobel is the Warren Distinguished Professor of Law at the University of San Diego, the founding director of the Center for Employment and Labor Policy (CELP), and the award-winning author of several books and numerous articles.
12/11/202344 minutes, 58 seconds
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The Unique Experience of a Justice-Impacted Law Student

After a criminal pays their debt to society, should they continue to suffer additional consequences for their crime for the rest of their life? Ricky Panayoty developed a deep passion for the law while serving a 10-year sentence for robbery, but really didn’t know whether he could apply to college, let alone law school, after being released. Law students come from a multitude of backgrounds, but justice-impacted individuals like Ricky often have many more obstacles to overcome. Faculty host Todd Berger talks with host Chay Rodriguez about her interview with Ricky discussing his incarceration, the experiences that fueled his interest in law, and his circuitous path to law school. They also highlight the perspective a justice-impacted individual brings to the legal profession and examine policies and procedures that affect the future prospects of these individuals.    Ricky Panayoty is a Juris Doctor candidate at Atlanta's John Marshall Law School and worked as a summer intern at Bryant Green & Associates.
10/23/202343 minutes, 52 seconds
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Don’t Let Law School Crush Your Creativity

As law students learn to be lawyers, some feel that they lose themselves—that their prior creative, dynamic individuality is slowly replaced by an unrecognizable law school robot. If you’ve experienced this disorienting feeling, you’re not alone. Host Leah Haberman is joined by Professor Michelle Falkoff of Northwestern University to talk about how to hang on to your creativity in law school. In their conversation, they examine the art of communication through legal writing and how originality and personal authenticity help you become an even better lawyer.  This episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast is full of new voices! Faculty host Professor Todd Berger is joined by student hosts Leah Haberman and Chay Rodriguez for a new season of episodes focusing on topics important to today’s law students. 
9/18/202335 minutes, 8 seconds
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An Interview with Prominent Defense Attorney Mark Geragos

Mark Geragos made a name for himself successfully representing Susan McDougal, President Bill Clinton’s erstwhile business partner, following her conviction related to the 1990s Whitewater controversy. Since then, he has represented many prominent figures—from politicians to Hollywood elites to pro athletes and more—and has a multitude of fascinating stories to tell. DeMario Thornton talks with Mark about his path through law school, his career choices, and much more.  Mark Geragos is Principal with the internationally known trial law firm of Geragos & Geragos where he has represented some of the most prominent figures in the world.
8/14/202329 minutes, 29 seconds
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Successful Bar Prep: Balancing Discipline and Downtime

The July bar exam is right around the corner, and if you’re like most recent law school grads, you’ve probably got some pre-test jitters. DeMario Thornton welcomes young lawyer Taylor DiChello to pick her brain on strategies for successful bar prep and test-taking. Taylor discusses her approach to studying, the usefulness of BARBRI courses, the structure of the bar exam, and much more. Tune in for practical tips and reassurances to calm your nerves as the exam approaches.  Taylor DiChello is a corporate associate at Gunderson Dettmer where she specializes in the representation of emerging growth companies throughout their life cycles.
7/10/202331 minutes, 3 seconds
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Niche Legal Practice: Exploring Construction Law

Do you have a particular interest outside of becoming a lawyer? With how incredibly broad the law is, a niche practice area might just align with your passions. For Arlan Lewis, his experience in architecture and some serendipitous happenings in law school led him to a fulfilling career in construction law. DeMario Thornton talks with Arlan about his career path, the nuances of construction law, and his top advice for today’s law students, no matter what area of the law they choose to pursue.   Arlan D. Lewis is a partner at Blueprint Construction Counsel, LLP.
6/21/202335 minutes, 48 seconds
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Accessing Mental Health Help for Law Students

Law school, bar prep, and the legal profession in general can be hard on mental health, but there is help through Lawyer Assistance Programs that even law students can access. DeMario Thornton talks with Molly Ranns about the services and support available to help law students and professionals cope with stress, anxiety, depression, and substance abuse. Molly also outlines what signs and symptoms law students should be aware of to help them assess their own mental well-being. Molly Ranns is program director for the Lawyers and Judges Assistance Program at the State Bar of Michigan and a co-host of the State Bar of Michigan’s On Balance Podcast. Find out more about the Michigan Bar’s program: Lawyers & Judges Assistance Program - State Bar of Michigan [email protected] Or, search for your state’s LAP program here: ABA Directory of Lawyer Assistance Programs Mentioned in this episode: The Prevalence of Substance Abuse and Other Mental Health Concerns Among American Attorneys  Suffering in Silence: The Survey of Law Student Well-Being and the Reluctance of Law Students to Seek Help for Substance Use and Mental Health Concerns
5/8/202326 minutes, 58 seconds
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A Career in Cannabis Law with Jerome Crawford

A lot of us started law school thinking we knew exactly what we would do with a law degree. So what happens when a surprising, but very different opportunity comes along? Jerome Crawford didn’t set out to become a cannabis attorney, but he’s thankful for the goals and pursuits that made him into a good lawyer and led him to the career he enjoys today. DeMario Thornton talks with Jerome about both his law school and professional experiences and why law students should never feel guilty about pivoting to new and different opportunities in law. Jerome Crawford is Chief Legal Officer at Pleasantrees Cannabis Company.
4/10/202338 minutes, 37 seconds
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The Real Law School Experience with Sarah Atkinson

Law school is tough, but you’re not alone! DeMario Thornton welcomes fellow law student Sarah Atkinson to talk through the highs and lows of law school. They share their struggles and discuss the ways they have navigated the stresses and uncertainties of legal education, summer internships, job-hunting, bar prep, and more. Sarah Atkinson is a 3L at the University of Alabama School of Law
3/13/202338 minutes, 40 seconds
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A Conversation With Professor Deleso A. Alford

DeMario Thornton welcomes Professor Deleso A. Alford to discuss her work at the intersection of legal and medical education, where her scholarship helps students gain a broader understanding of how race, gender, and classism have shaped these two fields of study. Professor Alford shares highlights from her studies of Henrietta Lacks, critical race theory, cultural competency, and other histories (or HER stories) of black women and their experiences in our healthcare systems. Professor Deleso A. Alford is the Rachel Emanuel Endowed Professor at Southern University Law Center.
2/13/202335 minutes, 21 seconds
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The Legal Accountability Project – Combatting Inequities and Abuse in Judicial Clerkships

In the midst of a nightmarish judicial clerkship, Aliza Shatzman found that there was almost no protection for her, a lowly clerk, suffering harassment at the hands of a seemingly all-powerful judge. This experience and its aftermath spurred Aliza on to create The Legal Accountability Project. Host DeMario Thornton talks with Aliza about how the Project’s research and partnerships are bringing much-needed transparency to the judicial clerkship experience to create more resources and ensure better outcomes for future clerks. Aliza Shatzman is the president and co-founder of the Legal Accountability Project.
1/9/202337 minutes, 44 seconds
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Unpacking Law360’s 2022 Summer Associates Survey

What can you expect when trying for a spot at one of the much coveted summer associateships? DeMario Thornton talks with Craig Savitzky of Law360 about the insights gleaned from the 2022 Summer Associates Survey. This two-part survey looks at law students’ approaches to the application and interview processes and then revisits students after their associateships to assess their program experiences. Craig Savitzky is a senior data analyst at Law360.
12/12/202249 minutes, 59 seconds
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I Wish I’d Known - Michael Nava’s Perspectives on Minority Lawyer Challenges

Minority lawyers operating in white-dominated spaces face unique challenges as they navigate careers in the legal profession. As negative stereotypes assault them from without, self-doubt and imposter syndrome can develop within. DeMario Thornton welcomes Michael Nava, a gay, Mexican-American author and attorney, to gain insights from his remarkable career and hear his thoughts on overcoming discrimination and supporting diversity in the legal world. Michael Nava is the author of an acclaimed series of seven crime novels featuring gay, Latino criminal defense lawyer Henry Rios. Michael spent many years working as an attorney in California and retired from the law in July 2016.
11/14/202230 minutes, 43 seconds
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Omarosa, Part II: The Historically Black College and University Experience

Returning guest Omarosa Newman joins Demario Thornton to go into deeper detail about her educational journey through multiple Historically Black Colleges and Universities and why she chose to attend Southern University–also an HBCU–for law school. Since their inception, HBCUs have focused on educating brilliant young minds. Tune in to learn more about the unique experience students find at these institutions. Check out Omarosa’s book, Unhinged: An Insider's Account of the Trump White House. Omarosa Newman is a reality tv star, a communications professional, and a 1L at Southern University Law Center.
10/10/202220 minutes, 42 seconds
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Omarosa: Fame, Politics, & The Perks of Being a Non-Traditional Law Student

You know her from “The Apprentice,” “Big Brother,” Trump’s White House, and more; and now she’s in the middle of law school just like you! Brand-new Law Student Podcast host DeMario Thornton chats with Omarosa about her unusual path to law school, her reality tv experiences, the confidence she feels as a non-traditional student with plenty of life experience to draw from, and what she hopes to do with her law degree.  Omarosa Newman is a reality tv star, a communications professional, and a 1L at Southern University Law Center.
9/12/202227 minutes, 38 seconds
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The Ultimate Discussion of IP Law with Howard Leib

Intellectual property law touches so many corners of law in general, and those interested in pursuing it may take any number of paths in legal practice. To explore the vast world of IP law, Meg Steenburgh welcomes Howard Leib to learn from his exciting career in IP and entertainment law. They dig into the nuances of trademarks, discuss a variety of newsworthy IP matters, and Howard shares insights on how to work toward your own IP law goals. Howard Leib is an entertainment and IP attorney, a law professor, a political and community activist, and hosts a comedy radio show on WRFI-FM in Ithaca, NY.
8/29/202252 minutes, 34 seconds
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Court Packing Explained, with Professor Todd Berger

Arguably, a Supreme Court appointment is the greatest prize in American politics, perhaps more so than the presidency. In consequence, these positions lend themselves to manipulation and tactical moves where possible, in spite of past norms. ABA Law Student Podcast host Meg Steenburgh welcomes Professor Todd Berger to discuss the concept of court packing, its connotations and implications, and how it could actually bring balance to the Supreme Court. They also discuss the report generated by Biden’s Presidential Commission on SCOTUS, and whether their findings offer any clarity on potential reforms in the Court. Professor Todd A. Berger is a Professor of Law and Director of Advocacy Programs at Syracuse University College of Law.
7/27/202238 minutes, 12 seconds
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A Deep Dive Into the Released Dobbs Decision, with Vice Dean Keith Bybee

Even though much has been said about the prematurely leaked draft decision of Dobbs, there’s a great deal to unpack now that the final opinion has been issued. Law Student Podcast host Meg Steenburgh welcomes back Syracuse University College of Law Vice Dean Keith Bybee to explore the reasoning of the opinion as well as the newly released concurring and dissenting opinions. Get a handle on this landmark decision that has raised many questions for law students and professors alike. Professor Keith Bybee is Vice Dean and Paul E. and Hon. Joanne F. Alper ’72 Judiciary Studies Professor at Syracuse University College of Law.
6/30/202253 minutes, 33 seconds
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Examining the Supreme Court Draft Leak with Vice Dean Keith Bybee

In the wake of the Supreme Court draft leak, many are questioning what ramifications its language could have on a number of past court decisions, as well as Americans’ rights in a variety of other areas. Law Student Podcast host Meg Steenburgh gets perspective on these issues from Vice Dean Keith Bybee. They examine the interplay of courts, politics, and the media, and discuss our nation’s legal processes throughout history. Professor Keith Bybee is Vice Dean and Paul E. and Hon. Joanne F. Alper ’72 Judiciary Studies Professor at Syracuse University College of Law.   
5/30/202244 minutes, 13 seconds
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Military Legal Practice and Perspectives on the Law of War

Major General John Altenburg was instrumental in transforming the practice of law in the military through his leadership and immersive approaches for military lawyer training. Meg Steenburgh talks with General Altenburg about the legal infrastructure of the United States Military, his thoughts on the law of war and its implications in the Ukraine conflict, and what advice he has to offer for today’s law students.  Major General John D. Altenburg Jr. (USA, Retired) is Of Counsel at Greenberg Traurig, LLC, where he focuses his practice on corporate governance and sensitive, internal investigations in the defense, homeland security sector, and the multilateral development bank sector. 
4/25/202242 minutes, 21 seconds
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Understanding the Weaponization of Social Media with P.W. Singer

Information and disinformation campaigns are centuries old, but our social media era has given new and rapid thrust to the sharing of ideas, both for good and ill intent. Meg Steenburgh and Peter W. Singer discuss his book, LikeWar: The Weaponization of Social Media, which analyzes the poisonous effects of disinformation on politics, war, and social issues worldwide. They look at the role of governments, laws, and individuals; and our collective responsibility to support digital literacy and engage in positive digital citizenship.  Peter Warren Singer is strategist at New America, a Professor of Practice at Arizona State University, and founder and managing partner at Useful Fiction LLC. Thank you to our sponsor NBI.
3/28/202249 minutes, 20 seconds
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Russia v. Ukraine: The Policy and Legal Considerations of an Unprovoked Attack on a Sovereign Nation

In the conflict instigated by Russia in Ukraine, we have already seen numerous and outrageous Russian violations of the Laws of Armed Conflict, but what legal recourse is there against these acts? Meg Steenburgh of the ABA Law Student Podcast interviews Judge James E. Baker to learn about the interplay of law and war on the international stage. Judge Baker examines Russia’s actions to date and offers insights on how the U.S. and other international players can and/or should respond as they follow the rule of law. They also discuss new uses of AI in war, historical examples that compare to Ukraine’s struggle against its aggressor, and why law matters even if a wartime opponent refuses to adhere to it.  Judge James E. Baker is director of the Syracuse University Institute for Security Policy and Law, a professor at the Syracuse College of Law and the Maxwell School of Citizenship and Public Affairs, and a Distinguished Fellow at the Georgetown Center for Security and Emerging Technology, Georgetown University. He previously served as a Judge and Chief Judge on the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Armed Forces.   Thank you to our sponsor NBI.
3/8/202252 minutes, 15 seconds
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Do We Really Need the Bar Exam?

Recent bar exam criticisms have left many in the legal sphere questioning whether the test really does what it claims. Is it still an essential step in legal licensure, or is it just a tired tradition? To help law students understand the many facets of this issue, Meg Steenburgh welcomes Josh Block and Adam Allington to discuss arguments for and against the bar exam that were recently aired in a three-part series from the UnCommon Law podcast.  Josh Block is the executive producer for video and audio at Bloomberg Industry Group. Adam Allington is a senior audio producer for podcasts at Bloomberg Industry Group and host of the UnCommon Law podcast.   Thank you to our sponsor NBI.
1/24/202237 minutes, 33 seconds
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Law School, Lawyering, and How One Relates to the Other

Podcast host Meg Steenburgh welcomes recent grad Shannon Knapp and fellow law students Sarah Roberts and Tiffany Love to get their perspectives on law school, legal practice, and life! They each discuss their unique student and real-world experiences—sharing the paths they’ve chosen to pursue, tips for self-care and motivation, and what has helped them handle the rigors of law school and entrance into the profession. Shannon Knapp is a recent graduate of Syracuse University School of Law and an Associate Attorney at Bond, Schoeneck & King PLLC in central New York.  Sarah Roberts is an entrepreneur based in eastern Texas and a 2L at Syracuse University School of Law. Tiffany Love is an Air Force spouse, civilian paralegal, and 3L at Syracuse University School of Law. Thank you to our sponsor NBI.
12/27/202138 minutes, 11 seconds
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The Life of a Supreme Court Correspondent

Meg Steenburgh of the ABA Law Student Podcast welcomes Adam Liptak to learn about his career as a legal journalist. Adam explains his typical work cycle as Supreme Court correspondent for The New York Times and offers insights on how a law degree translates into the world of journalism. They also discuss some of the Supreme Court’s upcoming cases and Adam shares his top advice for today’s law students.  Adam Liptak covers the Supreme Court for The New York Times.    Thank you to our sponsor NBI.
11/22/202130 minutes, 5 seconds
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Intellectual Property and Changing Social Justice Needs

Intellectual property is most often understood in terms of its economic value, but how do our current laws affect everyday creators and innovators? Meg Steenburgh welcomes Professor Jessica Silbey to discuss current issues in IP law and how the mindsets and expectations of younger generations seem to be at odds with the broad scope of many of these laws. They also discuss Professor Silbey’s expertise in film and its evolving uses as a legal tool. Professor Jessica Silbey is a Professor of Law at Boston University School of Law where she teaches and writes in the areas of intellectual property, constitutional law, and law and the humanities.   Thank you to our sponsor NBI.  
10/25/202136 minutes, 57 seconds
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Career Shift: How Krystal Williams Pivoted from Business to Law

Meg Steenburgh welcomes Krystal Williams to discuss her unconventional path to law. After many years as a business professional, Krystal’s hunger for learning led her to shift her sights to law. She shares some of her experiences as an older student and discusses where her legal career has taken her in the years since law school.  Krystal Williams is founder of Providentia Group, chairman of the board of KinoTek Software, and founder of The Alpha Legal Foundation. Thank you to our sponsor NBI.
9/29/202135 minutes, 5 seconds
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Jill Wine-Banks’ Rich and Varied Legal Career

In addition to her impressive legal experience in politics, military, private practice, journalism, and more, Jill Wine-Banks has also been a woman of many firsts throughout her legal career. Tune in with ABA Law Student Podcast host Meg Steenburgh for an in-depth interview with Jill about her many “first woman” roles, her memoir “The Watergate Girl,” and her advice for today’s law students.  Jill Wine-Banks is currently an MSNBC legal analyst, appearing regularly on the network’s primetime and daytime shows. Thank you to our sponsor NBI.
8/23/202148 minutes, 31 seconds
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Demystifying Hot Legal Topics of the Pandemic

From the FDA’s emergency use authorization of vaccines, to federalism concerns, to employee/employer relationships, to schools, and much more—legal issues related to the COVID-19 pandemic continue to crop up at a rapid pace. To help law students make sense of these evolving matters, Meg Steenburgh welcomes Harvard Law professor Glenn Cohen to share valuable insights on a wide variety of pandemic-era legal topics.  Professor Glenn Cohen is one of the world's leading experts on the intersection of bioethics and the law.  Thank you to our sponsor NBI.
8/10/202135 minutes, 52 seconds
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Mental Health in the Legal Profession

Patrick Krill discusses legal field mental health issues and offers strategies for monitoring and improving personal wellness. Thank you to our sponsor NBI.
6/21/202136 minutes, 46 seconds
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Career Preparedness: Navigating Career Choices in Law School and Beyond

Thankfully, career opportunities for law students and new lawyers seem to be increasing as COVID concerns abate. But, how can you best prepare yourself for actually getting the job you want? Meg Steenburgh welcomes Howard University School of Law’s Lauren Jackson to discuss tips and tactics for pursuing a fulfilling legal career. She emphasizes the importance of networking from day one of law school and advises students to keep an open mind about the opportunities that come their way. 
6/2/202127 minutes, 3 seconds
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Critical Issues in National Security Law

National security expert and Syracuse University professor William Banks sheds light on how current events interact with our nation’s security and the law. Thank you to our sponsor NBI.
4/20/202126 minutes, 59 seconds
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The Pursuit of a Civil Right to Counsel

Public Justice Center staff attorney John Pollock outlines current efforts to institute the right to counsel in civil matters.
3/31/202135 minutes, 41 seconds
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Housing and Eviction Law: Helping Tenants in the Midst of COVID-19

Zach Neumann explains how lawyers and law students can help tenants facing eviction during the pandemic.
2/26/202125 minutes, 54 seconds
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Helping Litigants Help Themselves: The Ins and Outs of a Legal Help Program

Angela Tripp shares insights into her rewarding work with the successful Michigan Legal Help Program.
1/29/202122 minutes, 53 seconds
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Against All Odds: Jim St. Germain’s Journey From Juvenile Delinquency to Community Leader

Jim St. Germain shares his experiences in the juvenile justice system and the critical role of mentors in his path to becoming a leader in his community.
12/14/202051 minutes, 39 seconds
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Examining Racial Inequality in Juvenile Justice

Attorney Natasha Fortune discusses her work at the Legal Aid Society of New York in the Juvenile Rights Practice and the cycles of racial injustice that affect her work with children of color.
11/10/202024 minutes, 12 seconds
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Representing Power: A Conversation with Attorney Robert Barnett

Attorney Robert Barnett sits down with host Meghan Steenburgh to discuss his storied career including his work with ten Presidential campaigns.
9/28/202030 minutes, 6 seconds
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A Career in Legal Aid — Perspectives from Sally Fisher Curran

Sally Fisher Curran discusses her career in legal aid.
6/11/202026 minutes, 25 seconds
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Richard Freer: Insights on Bar Review and Civil Procedure

Professor Richard Freer discusses his career and passion for helping students reach their potential.
5/7/202039 minutes, 11 seconds
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Law School Innovators: Taking Legal Ed Online

ABA Law Student Podcast host Meghan Steenburgh hosts two sets of interviews focused on online legal education.
4/9/202027 minutes, 6 seconds
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Dean Rodney Smolla: How Experiential Learning Makes Better Future Lawyers

Rodney Smolla, dean of the Delaware Law School of Widener University, discusses his career and offers practical advice for law students.
3/12/202031 minutes, 44 seconds
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Erwin Chemerinsky: Litigator, Educator, Scholar

Erwin Chemerinsky, dean of the University of California Berkeley School of Law, shares insights from his career and offers guidance to today’s law students.
2/6/202030 minutes, 22 seconds
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Lawyer, Marine, & Senator: Career Highlights with US Senator Dan Sullivan

Dan Sullivan shares his career journey and advice for today’s law students.
1/9/202037 minutes, 52 seconds
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Career in Focus: Colorado’s U.S. Attorney Jason Dunn

Colorado U.S. Attorney Jason Dunn shares his career experiences and offers guidance for law students as they enter the profession.
11/15/201919 minutes, 45 seconds
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The Law Student Roundtable: Examining Stress–Offering Hope

Rachel Gentry, Kennedy LeJeune, and KyMara Guidry join host Ashley Baker for a roundtable discussion of law student mental health issues.
10/31/201943 minutes, 6 seconds
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Dealing With the Pressures of Law School

Dionne Smith offers guidance for law students to manage their personal well-being throughout the rigors of law school.
10/10/201915 minutes, 19 seconds
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The 2019-2020 Goals of the ABA's Law Student Division Council

Newly elected ABA Law Student Division national chair Johnnie Nguyen and delegate of communications Julie Merow discuss the goals of the 2019-2020 council
9/12/201924 minutes, 9 seconds
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What Can You Do with Your Law Degree?

Gaylynn Burroughs shares insights for law students on how to hone in on the areas of law that align with their personal and professional goals.
8/13/201910 minutes, 16 seconds
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Pro Bono Scholars and Increased Representation: Dissecting Law Student Division Resolutions

Matthew Wallace explains two of the resolutions up for consideration before the ABA House of Delegates.
7/12/201920 minutes, 59 seconds
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Wisdom from Immediate Past ABA President Hilarie Bass

Host Kris Butler sits down with Hilarie Bass to discuss her career highlights and advice for today’s law students. Together, they explore her chosen path and what led her to become president of the American Bar Association. In addition, Hilarie reviews some of her notable cases, encourages young lawyers to pursue pro bono work, and offers insight into the issue of mental well-being in the legal profession.
6/10/201933 minutes, 4 seconds
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Rabia Chaudry and the Case of Adnan Syed

The story of Adnan Syed has become one of the most famous criminal matters of recent American history. This meteoric rise into the popular consciousness can be largely credited to the tireless advocacy of Adnan’s friend Rabia Chaudry. Join ABA Law Student Podcast hosts Kristoffer Butler and Negeen Sadeghi-Movahed as they talk with Rabia about Adnan’s case, the role of discrimination in our criminal justice system, and what we all, law students and the general public, should learn from Adnan’s experien
5/16/201924 minutes, 46 seconds
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Mental Health and Well-Being: How Law Students Can Get Help and Help Others

Raising awareness is helping to remove the stigma surrounding lawyer well-being. In this episode, host Kris Butler talks to Terry Harrell and John Berry about mental health and well-being in the legal profession and law schools. Terry and John talk about how they became involved with mental health awareness in the legal community and explain the types of support available through lawyer assistance programs.
4/16/201932 minutes
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Cultural Competency — How to Handle Bias and Develop Understanding

In law school and as they enter the legal profession, law students need to have the ability to understand and appropriately interact with diverse groups. Host Ashley Baker talks to Kennedy LeJeune, Miosotti Tenecora, and De'Jonique Carter about the importance of developing cultural competency as a law student. They discuss the need for more training for all legal professionals and offer their strategies for overcoming personal bias and developing respect for diverse cultures and world views.
3/25/201931 minutes, 7 seconds
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Real Changes for Real Diversity: A Discussion On the Efforts for Inclusivity in the Legal World

In this episode, host Kristoffer Butler talks to Jerome Crawford and Tiffany Buckley-Norwood about how the legal profession can become more welcoming for attorneys of color. They discuss what real efforts for diversity should look like in law firms and encourage all legal professionals to create truly inclusive and accessible firms. They also talk about how law students can reach back into their communities in order to encourage more young people to consider entering law school.
2/14/201936 minutes, 46 seconds
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How to Survive Law School with Children

In this episode, host Ashley Baker talks to Shawnita Goosby, Crystal Taylor, and Meghan Matt about how they manage their lives as mothers in law school. They offer advice on how to create support systems that can help parents handle the stresses of law school and encourage other parents to take heart and know that it can be done!
1/17/201946 minutes, 29 seconds
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Space Law: The Next Frontier for Lawyers

Host Kristoffer Butler talks to Dr. Maria-Vittoria Carminati and Dr. Michael Foerster about the future of space and telecommunications law. We are fundamentally a people of exploration and adventure, and our attempts at reaching further into space create a need for forward-thinking laws that will protect other planets and our own. Dr. Carminati and Dr. Foerster discuss this exciting area of the law and give young lawyers insight into how to enter this field.
12/13/201823 minutes, 39 seconds
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How to be Successful in Law School

Having difficulty navigating your hectic law school schedule? You’re not alone! Your new hosts, Ashley Baker and Kristoffer Butler, talk to Negeen Sadeghi-Movahed, chairwoman of the ABA Law Student Division, about law student life and her goals as chair. They discuss tips for handling a busy schedule, give internship advice, and talk about prioritizing what matters during finals.
11/21/201819 minutes, 48 seconds
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Diary of a Part-Time Special Education Lawyer

Host Caitlin Peterson talks to Melissa Waugh about her experience as a mother to hyphenated kids and a part-time lawyer specializing in special education law. She discusses how being a mother helps her connect with her clients and and the advantages of specializing in a niche area of the law. She also shares a plethora of resources for young lawyers who are interested in special education law including books, courses, and the requirements they would need to meet.
6/8/201831 minutes, 28 seconds
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How to Overcome Barriers as a Young, Aspiring Judge

Judge Wilhelmina Wright is the first African American woman to serve on the Minnesota Supreme Court. Host Caitlin Peterson talks to Judge Wilhelmina Wright, who shares advice with young, aspiring judges about building confidence, taking responsibility, and overcoming barriers in their careers. She also shares what it was like growing up with the lingering effects of segregation and the support she found in her community.
5/10/201828 minutes, 22 seconds
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Documenting an Icon: The RBG Documentary

The documentary RBG explores the quiet rise of Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg into a pop culture icon and, more importantly, a powerful voice in the nation’s highest court. Hosts Caitlin Peterson and John Weber talk about the movie with the people who made it, Betsy West and Julie Cohen. They discuss what makes the film unique, from music choice to why they chose the subject, as well as what makes Justice Ginsburg worthy of her own documentary.
4/25/201826 minutes
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Maintaining Mental Health at Law School

It can be hard to maintain mental wellness as a law student because of established stigmas and a lack of available resources. But, because wellness helps with success, students are taking action to change how law schools approach this subject. We discuss how students are collaborating with their schools to bring attention to mental health issues and how other schools, divisions, and firms can help get the word out.
3/16/201828 minutes, 59 seconds
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Serving the Underserved: BYU’s Immigration Clinic

The rhetoric of the Trump administration has brought a lot of attention to the topic of immigration and refugees. In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host John Weber talks to Carl Hernandez about the immigration clinic at Brigham Young University. Their clinic is managed mainly by students and meets a great need in the Utah community which has a large immigrant population. Carl discusses how the clinic got started and how it provides access to justice to immigrants and refugees while also providing experience to the law students that keep it up and running. Carl Hernandez teaches constitutional litigation and professional skills courses at the J. Reuben Clark Law School at BYU and has initiated and supervises clinical alliances with the Utah State Legislature, non-profit organizations, community-based organizations and economic development agencies.
1/3/201840 minutes, 52 seconds
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The Life of a Law Professor

When you think of a law professor you probably imagine whiteboards, textbooks, and a red pen, but the life of a law professor is often not confined to the classroom. In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Caitlin Peterson talks to professor Benjamin Davis about his experience as a law professor including the process of research, the important experiences he gained through his ABA membership, and what makes his job so fun. He also shares advice to law students about how to foster a relationship with a professor and the advantages of such a relationship. Professor Benjamin Davis teaches in the areas of contracts, alternative dispute resolution, arbitration, public international law, and international business transactions at the University of Toledo.
11/28/201749 minutes, 15 seconds
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Introducing the New ABA Law Student Podcast Host, John Weber

The end of bar exam season results in many happy law grads, an exciting future of career paths, and a new ABA Law Student Podcast host! In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Kareem Aref talks to new host John Weber about why he chose to run for the Law Student Division’s delegate of communications and why it’s important that law students get more involved with the division. John also discusses his time as an AP government teacher during the 2012 election and seeing firsthand the impact of that election on his students. As he says, John has big hosting shoes to fill, but he is excited for the opportunity to discuss the issues that matter most to law students. John Weber is a rising 3L at the University of Louisville Brandeis School of Law. He is also delegate of communications, publications, and outreach for the ABA Law Student Division.
9/15/201713 minutes, 29 seconds
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New ABA Law Student Division Chair Takes on Immigration

Immigration is a hot topic both in and outside of the legal realm, but for Thomas Kim it’s more than just a popular subject. Having been taken advantage of by his own immigration lawyer, he has become a passionate immigration rights activist. In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Kareem Aref talks to Thomas Kim, the new chair of the ABA’s Law Student Division, about what motivates him, what his goals are for his term, and his latest resolution that claims immigration status shouldn’t keep a student from pursuing a legal education. Thomas Kim is the 2017-2018 division chair of the ABA’s Law Student Division. He is also a rising 3L at Sandra Day O’Connor College of Law at Arizona State University and currently serves at the secretary-treasurer of the ABA Law Student Division.
8/29/201711 minutes, 18 seconds
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Broken Promises and Public Service Loan Forgiveness - Rebroadcast

Law school is essential to becoming a successful lawyer but it doesn’t come cheap. Public Service Loan Forgiveness was a program put in place to entice young lawyers to take public service positions which have historically paid less than private sector positions. After ten years of making on-time, full payments while in a public service role, the loan would be forgiven. Recently, though, the Department of Education was sued by the ABA for not keeping its promises. Even after declaring those involved in the program to be fully qualified for loan forgiveness, it was later decided later that they were not qualified. In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Chris Morgan discusses these events with the president of the ABA, Linda Klein. They dive into the original goals of the program, why the program is necessary, and actions the ABA is currently taking to ensure those relying on the program are compensated. Linda concludes by saying that the Department of Education’s decision will also affect the ability of the ABA to provide legal services to those that need it most. Linda Klein is the senior managing shareholder at Baker Donelson Bearman Caldwell & Berkowitz and president of the American Bar Association. Klein’s practice, based in Atlanta, includes most types of business dispute resolution, including contract law, employment law and professional liability, working extensively with clients in the construction, higher education and pharmaceutical industries.
7/31/201720 minutes, 23 seconds
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The Gamble of Public Service Loan Forgiveness

Young lawyers are needed to fill public service roles but often law school debt funnels them into higher paying positions. The Public Service Loan Forgiveness (PSLF) program was aimed to help this issue by forgiving student debt after ten years of qualifying employment at the local, state, or federal level. In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Chris Morgan talks to ABA President Linda Klein about the PSLF program, how it has fallen short, and the resulting suit that the ABA filed against the Department of Education. She also discusses the future of the trial and how to raise awareness as it continues. Linda Klein is the current President of the American Bar Association. In her practice life, she is managing shareholder for the Georgia offices of Baker, Donelson, Bearman, Caldwell & Berkowitz, LLP.
6/22/201716 minutes, 22 seconds
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O. J. Simpson and Reasonable Doubt with F. Lee Bailey

The O. J. Simpson trial is still heavy on people’s minds, especially with the release of shows like “O. J. Simpson: Made in America” and FX's “American Crime Story: The People vs OJ Simpson.” In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Chris Morgan talks to F. Lee Bailey, defense lawyer in the O.J. Simpson case, about his most notable cases and the definition of proof beyond a reasonable doubt. Bailey also discusses his view on how the media represented the O.J. trial and shares advice for young lawyers and law students aspiring to become trial lawyers. Francis Lee Bailey is an American former attorney. During his career he worked several high-profile trials and was one of the lawyers for the defense in the O. J. Simpson murder case.
5/23/201734 minutes, 24 seconds
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Defending Steven Avery, with Making A Murderer’s Dean Strang

It’s a question that has haunted the nation: did Steven Avery kill Teresa Halbach? The Netflix series Making A Murderer has brought the Steven Avery case to the forefront of everyone’s minds and, in doing so, has also brought attention to the lawyers involved. In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Chris Morgan talks to Dean Strang, one of Steven Avery’s defense lawyers, about the case from a lawyer’s perspective, including his take on notable scenes, the burden of proof, and the presence of reasonable doubt. He also talks about whether cameras should be used in court and shares advice for young lawyers aspiring to practice criminal defense. “Keep track of your own humanity and restore and replenish it by recognizing the humanity in every client you represent and every victim you encounter, and every citizen or witness you have to examine.” - Dean Strang Dean Strang practices in Madison, Wisconsin, as a shareholder in Strang Bradley, LLC. He was Wisconsin’s first Federal Defender and has argued in the United States Supreme Court, five federal circuits, and the Wisconsin Supreme Court.
4/25/201732 minutes, 20 seconds
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Discussing the O.J. Simpson Case with Defense Attorney Carl Douglas

Labeled the “trial of the century” by many, the O.J. Simpson case brought forth issues of race, celebrity, and police dishonesty. In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Chris Morgan talks to Carl Douglas, one of the defense attorneys in the O.J. Simpson murder case, about the case itself and the circumstances that ultimately lead to the controversial verdict. Their discussion includes the importance of context to the case, the complicated process of choosing jurors, and the origin of the phrase “If the glove doesn’t fit, we must acquit.” They also talk about what Carl has been up to since the case and his advice for young law students and lawyers. Carl Douglas is a lawyer specializing in police misconduct cases. He is best known for being one of the defense attorneys in the O.J. Simpson murder case.
3/22/201741 minutes, 41 seconds
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The Library of Congress: A Free Legal Research Resource

Research may not be the most exciting part of law school, but there are ways to make it easier, more interesting, and (perhaps most importantly) free. In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, hosts Sandy Gallant-Jones and Chris Morgan talk to Sheila Hollis and Barbara Bavis about the Law Library of Congress. While most law students know the Library of Congress exists, few know just how many resources it offers, like online access and a knowledgeable staff that’s ready to help. In their discussion, they also talk about legislative, judicial, and executive resources that law students can get online for free. Barbara Bavis joined the staff of the Law Library of Congress in 2012 as a Legal Reference Librarian. She provides legal research services to patrons, both at the reference desk in the Law Library Reading Room and via the Law Library’s Ask a Librarian service. Sheila Slocum Hollis is chair of the Washington, D.C. office of Duane Morris LLP. She just completed 12 years of service on the firm’s executive committee and partners’ board.
2/27/201722 minutes, 43 seconds
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Broken Promises and Public Service Loan Forgiveness

Law school is essential to becoming a successful lawyer but it doesn’t come cheap. Public Service Loan Forgiveness was a program put in place to entice young lawyers to take public service positions which have historically paid less than private sector positions. After ten years of making on-time, full payments while in a public service role, the loan would be forgiven. Recently, though, the Department of Education was sued by the ABA for not keeping its promises. Even after declaring those involved in the program to be fully qualified for loan forgiveness, the ABA decided later that they were not qualified. In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Chris Morgan discusses these events with the president of the ABA, Linda Klein. They dive into the original goals of the program, why the program is necessary, and actions the ABA is currently taking to ensure those relying on the program are compensated. Linda concludes by saying that the Department of Education’s decision will also affect the ability of the ABA to provide legal services to those that need it most. Linda Klein is the senior managing shareholder at Baker Donelson Bearman Caldwell & Berkowitz and president of the American Bar Association. Klein’s practice, based in Atlanta, includes most types of business dispute resolution, including contract law, employment law and professional liability, working extensively with clients in the construction, higher education and pharmaceutical industries. Mentioned in the episode: ABA sues Department of Education over retroactive denials to lawyers under Public Service Loan Forgiveness
1/31/201719 minutes, 46 seconds
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The Importance of Legal Tech and Continued Education

Law school provides many young attorneys with the critical thinking and analysis skills necessary to be a successful lawyer in today’s legal marketplace. In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, hosts Chris Morgan and Sandy Gallant-Jones speak with Continuing Education of the Bar (CEB) Executive Director Kelly Lake about the disruptive effects of legal technology and why continued learning and development is essential for legal professionals. Prior to joining CEB, Ms. Lake held key positions with Thomson Reuters in the UK and Asia, working to deliver a variety of legal workflow solutions and practice tools as well as with Westlaw in the UK, China, and India.
12/19/201623 minutes, 49 seconds
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The Challenges of Trying Death Penalty Cases

The process of trying criminal cases can be complex. In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, hosts Chris Morgan and Sandy Gallant-Jones speak with Washington state trial attorney Mark Vovos about his journey toward trying death penalty cases and the difficulties and challenges these cases can present. Mark Vovos has practiced law in the State of Washington for 44 years and his practice focuses on complex federal litigation in all aspects of criminal defense.
11/29/201630 minutes, 4 seconds
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Seeding Success: Cultivating YLD Opportunities with Bryan Rogers (Rebroadcast)

Many young lawyers turn to the Law Student Division of the ABA for invaluable resources, benefits, and leadership opportunities. However, it can be challenging for students who are interested in a deeper level of engagement in the ABA to continue their involvement as they enter the legal market. In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, which originally aired on March 24th 2016, host Fabiani Duarte chats with guest Bryan Rogers about the Young Lawyers Division and the Emerging Leaders Program that is helping law graduates seek significant leadership roles within the ABA. Bryan Rogers is an associate attorney with the law firm Swanson, Martin & Bell, LLP and has held many positions within the ABA Law Student Division and the ABA Young Lawyers Division.
10/31/201615 minutes, 20 seconds
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Communication Tips that Combat Gender Bias

In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Sandy Gallant-Jones speaks with McDermott Will & Emery partner Andrea Kramer about her new book, Breaking Through Bias: Communication Techniques for Women to Succeed at Work, and gender equality in the workplace. Andrea recalls the life experiences and occupational observations that motivated her and her husband to write their new book and expresses how important it is that women find ways to succeed in the workplace. She provides her tips to help women purposefully counter bias in the office and breaks down the four attributes, like cultivating the right attitude for success and maintaining high self awareness, for attuned gender communication. Andrea gives examples of how men in the workplace can also improve their communication with their female colleagues and closes the interview with her most important advice for women who have recently graduated from law school as they start their careers. Andrea S. Kramer is a partner in the international law firm of McDermott Will & Emery LLP where she heads the firm’s Financial Products, Trading and Derivatives Group. She is a founding member of the firm’s Diversity Committee and co-chair of the Gender Diversity Subcommittee. She previously served on both the firm’s Management and Compensation Committees. Andrea co-founded (2005) and now serves as chair of the Board of the Women’s Leadership and Mentoring Alliance (WLMA), a 501(c)(3) corporation that brings professional women together to mentor and support leadership opportunities for women of all stages of their careers.
9/15/201628 minutes, 38 seconds
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Finding Alternative Careers in the Law

In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Sandy Gallant-Jones talks with Above the Law Editor Joe Patrice, CuroLegal CEO Chad Burton, LegalZoom General Counsel Chas Rampenthal, Clio Lawyer in Residence Joshua Lenon, and Legal Talk Network Executive Producer Laurence Colletti about alternative careers in law. Joe opens the interview by advising law students to experiment if they are unsure as to what they should do with their practices. Chad reminds young lawyers that they can create their own career alternatives, there are many different ways of getting into existing fields outside of the law, and that graduates don’t have to be lawyers. Chas cautions law students to remember that their peers are going to be the captains of industry and that it is beneficial to treat everyone respectfully, use this time to make connections, and understand that the law is evolving and that you must evolve with it. Josh shares that most lawyers in their first jobs leave outside of five years and that young attorneys should be okay with moving on if their interests change or if they are unhappy with where they are occupationally. Laurence talks about a few of his struggles during law school and encourages students to find ways to be successful in their studies that works well for them. The group discusses their thoughts on how technology and the law will commingle in the future, how law schools can better accommodate and prepare students for emergent technology, and closes the interview with thoughts on how we can make law school a better learning experience for students. Joe Patrice is an editor at Above the Law. For over a decade, he practiced as a litigator at both Cleary, Gottlieb, Steen & Hamilton and Lankler Siffert & Wohl, representing a variety of individuals, institutions, and foreign sovereigns in criminal and civil matters. Then Joe left private practice to concentrate on making snide remarks about other lawyers which is at least as fulfilling as motion practice. Chad Burton is the founder of Burton Law, one of the leading virtual law firm structures. Formerly in a big law firm, he now represents technology-oriented companies from startups to multinational corporations. Additionally, he started CuroLegal, an outsourced practice management company for lawyers. Chas Rampenthal has served as general counsel for LegalZoom since 2003 and as corporate secretary since 2007. Before joining LegalZoom, Chas was a partner at Belanger and Rampenthal, LLC and an associate at Testa, Hurwitz & Thibeault, LLP and Thelen Reid & Priest LLP. He also served as an officer and aviator in the United States Navy. Chas received his B.S. in economics and math studies from Southern Illinois University at Edwardsville and a J.D. from the University of Southern California. Joshua Lenon is the lawyer in residence at Clio, an intuitive cloud-based legal practice management solution. He can be reached at [email protected]. An attorney admitted to the New York Bar, Joshua brings legal scholarship to the conversations happening both within Clio and with its customers. Laurence Colletti serves as the executive producer at Legal Talk Network where he combines his passion for web-based media with his experience as a lawyer. Previously, he was a solo practitioner and consultant in general business and commercial real estate.
8/31/201646 minutes, 9 seconds
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Transitioning from Military Law to Civilian Practice

In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Sandy Gallant-Jones speaks with General Jack Rives, executive director of the American Bar Association about his career as a military lawyer, his transition to civilian life, and his current role within the ABA. Jack reminisces about his passion for the legal profession from an early age, his undergraduate time at The University of Georgia on a Reserve Officers Training Corps Scholarship, and shares that he originally only planned to spend four years in the Air Force. After an educational delay that allowed him to attend law school, he entered the military as a judge advocate general (JAG). Jack provides a breakdown of the various occupational and travel opportunities that changed his initial plans and led to a 33 year long career as a military lawyer. He provides insight into the personal values, like integrity, strong work ethic, and service that aided him in becoming the first military lawyer to ever achieve the rank of three star general and emphasizes how these values are necessary for the success of every attorney. Jack takes time to commend veterans who are pursuing law degrees, discusses ways that law schools can better support these particular students, and talks about his journey transitioning from the military to civilian practice and his work with the ABA. He closes the interview with tips for law students on how to manage the stress and demand of their studies and the many benefits that joining The American Bar Association can have on their flourishing careers. General Jack Rives is originally from Rockmart, Georgia. Upon graduating from the University of Georgia School of Law, he began a 33-year career in the United States Air Force as a judge advocate general (JAG) where he became the first military attorney to attain the three-star rank of lieutenant general. During his time in service, General Rives led 2,600 lawyers and was awarded both the Distinguished Service Medal with oak leaf cluster and Defense Superior Service Medal.
8/30/201622 minutes, 35 seconds
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Courtroom Appropriate Fashion Tips for New Attorneys

In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, hosts Sandy Gallant-Jones and Kareem Aref chat with Brooks Brothers District Manager Mic Clark about courtroom appropriate fashion and wardrobe elements that every lawyer should have. Mic acknowledges that most law students are operating on a budget, but emphasizes that the goal is to use simple affordable pieces to build a wardrobe that gives you a functional week's worth of clothes. He states that most business is done primarily in blue and gray attire and encourages men to build on solid or patterned variants of those colors. By focusing on a classical, professional aesthetic consisting of quality basic pieces, you are investing in apparel that will last you for a very long time. Mic advises ladies to focus on blues, grays, and blacks for their basic pieces and discusses the importance of hem length. He reminds law students that although you are wearing classic pieces, and the guidelines for men and women are different, It’s important to have an element of your personal style present within your look and to have fun with the wardrobe building process. Mic shares that most people over-launder their clothing and closes the interview with his tips for maintaining your wardrobe long term. Mic Clark is the Brooks Brothers district manager for the San Francisco Bay area.
8/29/201610 minutes, 49 seconds
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The Challenges of Law School and Finding Your First Job

In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Kareem Aref speaks with Stark & D’Ambrosio, LLP partner Anna Romanskaya about her journey through law school and her struggles finding work as a legal practitioner. Anna shares that she never aspired to become a lawyer, had no family members that were attorneys, and that she perceived the profession as stuffy and intimidating. Her passion for crisis intervention and victim advocacy led her away from the undergraduate psychology focus she was pursuing at the University of California, Santa Barbara and towards a double major in law and society and political science. Anna recalls the lack of direction she felt in school and recounts how those feelings informed her decision to attend law school in order to gain the practical skills she would need to work in advocacy. She discusses the difficulties of being a 1L, finding herself on academic probation, and the internships and student organization participation that ultimately gave her the sense of connection and occupational purpose that helped her graduate from law school. Anna reflects on the sadness she felt upon losing her job during the recent economic downturn, the triumph of passing the bar exam, and the hard work required to secure her practice in family law. Before closing the interview she also provides tips on how to push through these challenges for law students experiencing similar hardships. Anna Romanskaya is a partner with Stark & D’Ambrosio, LLP and manages the firm’s family law division. She represents clients in all aspects of family law, including pre and post marital agreements, dissolution, child custody, child and spousal support, property division and post judgment issues. Anna has been recognized as a Rising Star by Super Lawyers in 2015 and 2016, as well as a Best of the Bar in 2015 and 2016 by the San Diego Business Journal. She is the Chair of the Young Lawyers Division of the American Bar Association (ABA) and is a graduate from the University of California, Santa Barbara where she double-majored in political science and law and society. She received her Juris Doctorate from Thomas Jefferson School of Law and is admitted to the State Bar of California and the U.S. District Court, Southern District of California.
8/26/201626 minutes, 37 seconds
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Pairing Legal Activism with Restorative Justice

Even though research shows that African American males are no more likely to use or sell drugs than Caucasian males, in at least 15 states they are admitted to prison on drug charges at rates 20 to 57 times higher. Some law students are drawn to pursue legal careers with the goal of bringing positive change to these and other statistics and to impact the criminal justice system on a neighborhood level. What can law students do to learn more about what restorative justice means and help to build a better criminal justice system professionally? In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast host Fabiani Duarte invites guest host Amanda Joy Washington to sit down with organizer, law student, and activist Ruby-Beth Buitekant to discuss restorative justice and the Black Lives Matter movement. Ruby-Beth opens by sharing some of her early work experience with the Center for Court Innovation, through the Youth Organizing to Save Our Streets program, and discusses the transformative effects the program has had on her Crown Heights, Brooklyn neighborhood. She then explores the concept that humans should be free of state and interpersonal violence, an approach that is the basis for a lot of her work. The group then analyzes the use of disruption as a tactic in activism and ponder the statement “All Lives Matter” that has arisen in response to the Black Lives Matter movement. Ruby-Beth then wraps up the discussion with some information on how law students can get more involved in, and learn more about, restorative justice.
7/6/201630 minutes, 11 seconds
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Ending Mass Incarceration Through Restorative Justice

A big motivator for some individuals to attend law school is the ability to positively influence the communities from which they come. However, what assistance can a lawyer provide for their neighborhood if they feel the community is being unfairly targeted by law enforcement? How can members of the profession have a positive effect on incarceration rates through the application of restorative justice techniques? In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Fabiani Duarte, along with guest host Andrew Scott and guest attorney Sarah Walton, take a look at mass incarceration in our criminal justice system and how restorative justice concepts could be applied. Sarah begins the interview by explaining her self-proclaimed moniker as a “free range attorney and abolitionist” and gives some insights into what those labels mean to her. She then talks about her work to help reduce the number of incarcerations through programs like pre-arrest diversion and some restorative justice tactics that law enforcement can implement to ensure the safety of all parties involved. The group then takes a moment to reflect on the disparate effects that The War on Drugs has had on low income communities and how new harm-reductive approaches to drug policing can improve public safety. Sarah then wraps up the discussion with an analysis of the stigma citizens returning from incarceration face in their communities and the things that law students can do, like attending court proceedings, to support members of their communities.
7/5/201637 minutes, 56 seconds
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Applying Restorative Justice Concepts to Capital Cases

When it comes to a capital case, prosecuting or defending an individual whose life rests on the verdict can be a personal struggle. How does a lawyer cope with the loss of a client and what restorative justice options can they seek in lieu of the death penalty? In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Fabiani Duarte and guest host Linsey Addington speak with Professor Sarah Gerwig Moore and Dr. Melissa Browning about the death penalty and ways restorative justice concepts can be used in capital cases. Sarah and Melissa begin by listing a few concepts and common misconceptions, such as the cost to the taxpayer for executing an inmate, that they believe should be considered when approaching the death penalty debate. Dr. Browning then goes into detail about how she learned about the Kelly Gissendaner case and what inspired her to get involved in seeking parole for Gissendaner. Professor Moore also gives some insight into her experience of being lead counsel seeking clemency for a death row inmate named Josh Bishop and explains the type of relationships lawyers can develop with these clients. The group then considers processes within the criminal justice system where restorative justice concepts can be applied and how these concepts, like seeking life without the possibility of parole, can reduce death row executions and promote communal well being.
7/5/201644 minutes, 21 seconds
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Substance Abuse and Mental Illness in the Legal Profession

Between 21% and 36% of practicing attorneys exhibit drinking behaviors that could be considered hazardous, harmful, or possibly alcohol dependent. 28% of licensed and employed attorneys are struggling with either mild, moderate, or severe depression, and 19% are battling with clinically significant levels of anxiety. How prevalent are mental health and substance misuse issues in the profession and what can young lawyers do to help reduce these numbers? In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Fabiani Duarte speaks with Hazelden Betty Ford Foundation Legal Professionals Program Director Patrick Krill about the prevalence of substance misuse and other mental health concerns within the occupation. Patrick explains his motivation for encouraging the creation of this study, mainly a lack of relevant drug use and mental health data, and explores possible reasons as to why so little research of this kind has been done on attorneys. He also explains the tools he used, like the Alcohol Use Disorders Identification Test (AUDIT) and Depression Anxiety Stress Scales (Dass 21), to measure alcohol consumption and mental health concerns among the pool of 15,000 attorneys surveyed. The conversation then shifts to an analysis of the survey results which show that young attorneys within their first 10 years of practice have the highest rates of mental health issues and problematic drinking. Patrick expounds upon these statistics by revealing that 90% of the individuals surveyed identified alcohol as their drug of choice. He wraps up the interview with some suggestions on how drinking culture can be decoupled from the legal profession and provides tips for law students on identifying if they struggle with mental illness and substance misuse and resources for those seeking help. Patrick Krill is director of the Hazelden Betty Ford Foundation Legal Professionals Program and a licensed attorney, board certified alcohol and drug counselor and graduate-level instructor in addiction counseling.
6/14/201647 minutes, 38 seconds
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Marcia Clark on "The People vs. O.J. Simpson," Sexism, and Her Latest Book

Marcia Clark is best known for being the lead prosecutor for theO.J. Simpson murder trial. The former Heisman Trophy Winner wasaccused and found not guilty of the June 1994 death of Nicole BrownSimpson and waiter Ronald Lyle Goldman in a trial that captivatedthe country. Thrust back into the spotlight by "The People vs. O.J.Simpson" miniseries, a new generation is now fascinated by Clark,the discrimination she faced during the trial, and the writingcareer that followed. In this episode of the ABA Law StudentPodcast, hosts Fabiani Duarte andSandy Gallant-Jones sit down with Marcia Clark,most notably known for serving as the prosecutor for the trial ofO.J. Simpson, to discuss her new novel “Blood Defense.” Marciaprovides deeper insight into the motivation behind the creation of,and the personality differences between, her long running characterRachel Knight and her new protagonist, Samantha Brinkman. She alsospeaks briefly about her experience writing through theprosecutorial lens and the catalyst behind her recent shift towardswriting from the perspective of the defense. The focus of thediscussion then pivots toward an analysis of her experiences duringthe O.J. Simpson case and her prosecutorial experience. Marciareflects on the adversity she faced during the trial as shebalanced raising a family, fighting a custody battle, and thesexism she experienced in the courtroom and the office. She closesthe interview with advice on helpful skills that law students candevelop while in school, such as discipline and persistence, andhow those experiences can be applied to their work in theprofession.
5/2/201629 minutes, 5 seconds
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Law School and Depression

20% of lawyers suffer from depression, more than double that of the general population. Beyond that, 60,000 law students suffer from depression by the end of their second year. What resources are available for lawyers who find themselves battling the rigors of the profession and the struggles of depression? In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, hosts Fabiani Duarte and Madison Burke sit down with trial lawyer and founder of the website “Lawyers with Depression” Daniel Lukasik to discuss depression in the legal profession. Daniel opens the show by sharing some of his personal experiences battling depression, his path to treatment, and how that led to the creation of his website. He then takes a moment to analyze the number of law students and lawyers who suffer from depression and why those statistics are much higher than the average population. During this investigation Daniel also shares signs that law students can look for to determine if they are suffering from depression and some of the ways that depression might manifest itself in one’s life. The group then shifts focus to Daniel’s documentary “A Terrible Melancholy: Depression in the Legal Profession” and discuss resources supporters and those battling depression can seek to aid in treatment. Daniel Lukasik is a trial lawyer with Maxwell Murphy LLP and the founder of the website “Lawyers with Depression.” He was also the executive producer for the documentary “A Terrible Melancholy: Depression in the Legal Profession.” Daniel graduated Magna Cum Laude from Buffalo State College and received his Juris Doctor from State University of New York at Buffalo Law School.
4/18/201642 minutes, 33 seconds
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How to Land the Right Summer Associates Program

Many law students, upon graduating, find it very difficult to acquire employment in the legal profession straight out of school. Numerous law firms are unwilling to hire recent grads that have no previous work experience listed on their resumes. What should a recent graduate do to help increase their chances of finding a firm that is the right fit for them while providing the work experience necessary to land your first job? In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast hosts Fabiani Duarte and Madison Burke sit down with Tort Trial & Insurance Practice Section Chair-Elect John Cartafalsa to discuss the summer associates program. John opens the episode with a little explanation of his educational history and peers back into his law school days to offer some advice to his younger law student self. He then chats specifically about his firm’s participation in hiring summer associates and what he looks for in a candidate, while Fabiani and Madison both inquire about the best tactics for law students to land these positions. The conversations wraps with some focused advice directed towards students seeking to find a law firm that is the perfect fit for them. John Cartafalsa is the chair-elect of the Tort Trial & Insurance Practice Section for the American Bar Association. John is a managing attorney at Zurich Staff Legal Services and received his bachelor of science degree from American University School of International Service. He received his Juris Doctor from Touro College Jacob D. Fuchsberg Law Center.
3/28/201615 minutes, 10 seconds
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ABA Law Student Division Board of Governors : Year in Review

The ABA Law Student Division serves to not only provide options for students to better engage with their peers but also to provide valuable leadership and career development opportunities. Individuals who wish to promote positive change within the profession will often seek to aid their peers by serving on the Law Student Division Board of Governors. In this ABA Law Student Podcast hosts Fabiani Duarte and Madison Burke sit down with members of the ABA Law Student Division to chat about their past year in review. The conversation opens with each board member explaining a bit about their law school background, the circuit they represent, and some of the changes their circuit went through over the year. The group then takes some time to discuss their favorite achievement that their respective law school was able to accomplish this year. The conversation wraps up with each governor providing tips and advice for the new board members that will be filling their positions once they leave. Mathew C. Mecoli, Third CircuitDrexel University Thomas R. Kline School of Law Akemini Ruby Isang, Fourth Circuit:University of South Carolina School of Law Marcus Sandifer, Fifth CircuitEmory University School of Law Krystal Yalldo, Sixth CircuitWestern Michigan UniversityThomas M. Cooley Law School Mayra Salinas-Menjivar, Fourteenth CircuitUniversity of Nevada Las Vegas,William S. Boyd School of Law Kirk W. Kabala, Fifteenth CircuitArizona Summit Law School Andrew Rhoden, M.S.American University, Washington College of LawWashington, DCDelegate to the ABA House of Delegates
3/25/201633 minutes, 27 seconds
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Seeding Success: Cultivating YLD Opportunities with Bryan Rogers

The Law Student Division of the ABA provides many young lawyers with invaluable resources, benefits, and leadership opportunities. However, many students who are interested in pursuing a deeper level of engagement in the ABA aren’t sure how to continue their involvement as they enter the legal market. In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Fabiani Duarte chats with guest Bryan Rogers about the Young Lawyers Division and the Emerging Leaders Program that is helping law graduates seek significant leadership roles within the ABA. Bryan Rogers is an associate attorney with the law firm Swanson, Martin & Bell, LLP. He also served as the Law Student Division representative to the ABA Board of Governors-Elect and as a 7th Circuit Governor. Bryan then moved on to be the Law Student Division representative member of the ABA Board of Governors. He also was a member of the inaugural class of the ABA Young Lawyers Division Emerging Leaders program. Bryan graduated from Valparaiso University School of Law (J.D., magna cum laude, 2013) and was the recipient of the ABA Law Student Division’s Golden Key Award.
3/24/201615 minutes, 4 seconds
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The Intersection of Law and Social Science with Ajay Mehrotra

Have you ever wondered how many lawyers continue to practice after acquiring their Juris Doctor Degree? Perhaps you’ve pondered how your legal knowledge can be applied to different types of public work or social activism. In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Fabiani Duarte takes an in-depth look at the American Bar Foundation research attempting to answer these questions with its director, Ajay K. Mehrotra. Ajay K. Mehrotra is the executive director of the American Bar Foundation. He also is an adjunct professor of history at Indiana University and served as the school’s associate dean for research. Ajay is the author of “Making the Modern American Fiscal State: Law, Politics and the Rise of Progressive Taxation, 1877-1929” (Cambridge University Press, 2013).
3/24/201618 minutes, 57 seconds
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Resolution 109: The Fight for Bar Exam Portability

One of the most demanding endeavors that any recent law grad will face is studying for and passing the bar exam. However, upon entering the legal market, many graduates aren’t aware of the challenges associated with transferring their bar exam scores between jurisdictions. In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, host Fabiani Duarte and guest Christopher Jennison, the Board of Governors representative to the Law Student Division, discuss their year-long fight to provide law students with more bar exam portability by encouraging the ABA House of Delegates to adopt Resolution 109. Christopher Jennison is the Board of Governors representative to the Law Student Division and sits on the ABA Board of Governors. He graduated from Syracuse University in 2012 with dual majors in public relations from Newhouse and policy studies from Maxwell. He also graduated with a master’s degree in public administration from the University of Pennsylvania in 2014. Christopher has been the law student liaison to the Standing Committee on Continuing Legal Education and was also the recipient of the Law Student Division’s Gold Key Award.
2/24/201619 minutes, 44 seconds
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Shaping Your Career Path with David Lat

As the law becomes ever more complex and the legal market continues to shift and grow, entering the workforce can be incredibly intimidating to a current student or recent grad. Sifting through the options and finding the career path that is right for you can sometimes feel daunting for even the most well-prepared of students. In this installment of the ABA Law Student Podcast David Lat, founder and managing editor of Above the Law, joins hosts Fabiani Duarte and Madison Burke to discuss his path to success and provide tips that can help students shape their burgeoning careers. David Lat is the founder and managing editor of Above the Law, a blog established in 2006 that provides news and commentary on the U.S. legal industry. Prior to this, he started Underneath Their Robes, a blog focused on the federal judiciary with pop culture magazine sensibilities. Before his career as a blogger, David attended Harvard College and Yale Law School. After school, he worked as a law clerk for Judge Diarmuid F. O'Scannlain of the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit, a litigation associate at Wachtell, Lipton, Rosen & Katz in New York, and a federal prosecutor in Newark, New Jersey. in 2014 David published his first book, Supreme Ambitions: A Novel, to outstanding acclaim.
2/19/201636 minutes, 28 seconds
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Student Loans: Saving Your Future After You Leap

If you are one of the 40 million Americans who funded their education with student loan debt, you may be asking yourself now what? The bad news: you probably can’t get out of it with bankruptcy. The good news: with over 1.3 trillion dollars locked up in American educational loans, the country has a vested interest to pave the way for repayment. So what does that mean for you? Tune in to find out. On this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, hosts Fabiani Duarte and Madison Burke talk with Credible Labs founder and Slate contributor Stephen J. Dash. Together, they discuss first steps in the post-borrowing world of student loan debt. Step One: Understand Your Situation This means you should know how much you owe and to whom. In addition, you should budget out your total earnings and total expenses. Step Two: Make a Plan By investigating your options for repayment, you will be able to make an informed choice. Primary options like consolidation, pay-as-you-earn, and refinancing all have pros and cons. Understanding the benefits and pitfalls of each repayment program will empower you to make the right choice for your situation. Step Three: Stick to the Plan Some repayment plans allow you to make future changes. Once you decide on a repayment plan, do your best to stick with it. If your financial situation changes, communicate with your servicer to see what, if any, options are available. Student Loan Issues Discussed In This Episode: Law School Death Spiral Long term repayment vs. short term repayment Loan Consolidation Pay As You Earn Programs Refinance Options Deferment Forbearance Return On Investment (ROI) for Education
1/21/201638 minutes, 3 seconds
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Student Loans: Look Before You Leap

With lower starting salaries and higher tuition rates, today’s law students face tough decisions when it comes to financing their education. In addition to school rank, employment rates, and average starting salaries, future lawyers need to be aware of loan terminology and how it affects their future ability to pay. But how much do you have to know to make an informed decision? Unfortunately, there is a lot to consider, including your future area of law, fixed vs. variable interest rates, short term loans vs. long term loans, tax implications, federal requirements, and much more. The good news is, there are organizations and people who can help. In this episode of ABA Law Student Podcast, hosts Fabiani Duarte and Madison Burke deep dive the treacherous waters of student loan debt with CommonBond CEO and Co-Founder David Klein. Together, they review many factors students should consider before signing one of the biggest contracts of their lives. In addition, they present a case study that may alarm some prospective borrowers. David Klein is CEO and co-founder of CommonBond, a lending platform that focuses on lowering the cost of student loans for borrowers and provides financial returns to investors. Prior to CommonBond, David worked in consumer finance at American Express as director of strategic planning and business development, where he led a $250M annual business. David started his professional career as a consultant at McKinsey & Company, where he advised clients in the financial services industry.
12/22/201542 minutes, 27 seconds
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Public Service Loan Forgiveness

If you are in or plan to go into public service, you may have heard about public service loan forgiveness (PSLF for short). This economic incentive was intended to attract and keep employees in public sector positions such as district attorney or public defender by offering student loan forgiveness following a minimum period of service and on-time payments towards the borrower’s debt. The cost of this benefit is borne by the taxpayer and is aimed at making public work more attractive despite the relative low pay. In recent times, the PSLF program has fallen under the scrutiny of budget cuts following the recession as Americans slog through the recovery period. Some critics believe that student loan borrowers in the public sector should pay for their own education especially with the relative job security and retirement benefits as compared to those in the private sector. Other critics state that not all public service positions should receive loan forgiveness and call for budgetary caps. But what would capping or eliminating public service loan forgiveness mean for our communities? In this extended two segment episode of ABA Law Student Podcast, hosts Fabiani Duarte and Madison Burke interview Bryan Tyson, the executive director of the Georgia Public Defender Council and Jonathan Rapping, co-founder of Gideon’s Promise. In segment one, we hear from Bryan about the debt to income gap, his organization’s survey of public defenders about PSLF, and the increased importance of public defenders outside the practice of law. In segment two, we hear from Jonathan about student debt’s barrier to public service, the lifelong commitment of student loans, and concerns about poor people not getting justice in the event of PSLF cuts or caps.
11/23/201548 minutes, 53 seconds
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ABA Board of Governors: How Law Students are Helping Themselves

ABA Law Student Podcast hosts Fabiani Duarte and Madison Burke sit down with Chris Jennison, the ABA Law Student Division’s representative to the ABA Board of Governors, to discuss the governing role of the ABA Board of Governors and how its actions affect the lives of law students and recent grads. Since 2009, the Law Student Division has been able to vote on the Board of Governors and they are actively using that power to improve the plight of fellow students. Currently they are advocating for Interpretation 305-2 which would allow ABA accredited schools to let students receive both pay and credit for their externships. In addition, they are supporting the spread of the Uniform Bar Exam, which allows one exam score to be applied to multiple state bars in the states that participate. The net effect will make it cheaper and easier to get admitted to the practice of law in multiple states. As for future initiatives, Chris discusses the Limited Licence Legal Technician program in Washington and increased student access to the American Bar Association’s various sections, divisions, and forums. Tune in to hear what’s being done about mounting student debt and the status of public service loan forgiveness.
10/28/201522 minutes, 51 seconds
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Senator Lindsey Graham on Getting Through Law School and Being a Lawyer

On this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, Senator Lindsey Graham joins hosts Fabiani Duarte and Madison Burke. Together, they discuss getting through law school, being an advocate, and public service loan forgiveness. Tune in to hear about his early career and the importance of having your character tested in law school.
10/8/201510 minutes, 38 seconds
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ABA President Brown Wants You!

Surviving law school is difficult enough, but law students also need to be thinking about how to best prepare themselves for the future. In this episode of the ABA Law Student Podcast, Fabiani Duarte and Madison Burke talk with Paulette Brown, current president of the American Bar Association, about her path through law school, advice she has for current law students, and legal initiatives she thinks might really interest young lawyers. Tune in to hear what qualities Ms. Brown would look for when hiring a lawyer who had just passed the bar.
10/8/201524 minutes, 44 seconds
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Which ABA Sections, Divisions, and Forums Should You Join?

Fabiani Duarte and Madison Burke interview leaders and representatives from a few of the 64 ABA sections, divisions, and forums. In this round robin format, each guest makes a two minute pitch explaining how law students can benefit from potential networking, education, and career path opportunities in the following: Young Lawyers Division Tort and Insurance Practice Section Law Practice Division Antitrust Law Section Criminal Justice Section Armed Forces Law Committee Administrative Law and Regulatory Practice Section Animal Law Committee
10/8/201528 minutes, 26 seconds
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BARBRI’s Richard Conviser on the Bar Exam

Richard Conviser joins hosts Fabiani Duarte and Madison Burke for a discussion about the history of BARBRI, why it was founded, and how it continues to help law students pass the most important exam of their career.
10/8/201524 minutes, 55 seconds
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What is the ABA Law Student Division?

In this extended-play first episode of ABA Law Student Podcast, we start with an interview of our two hosts (Fabiani Duarte and Madison Burke) before cutting to their first episode recorded at the ABA Annual Meeting in Chicago. While there, they discuss the ABA Law Student Division, its free membership, and how it’s helping law students around the country. Tune in to hear about their ambitions to provide paid externship credits, public service loan forgiveness, and debt counseling for those who need to take out student loans.
10/6/201554 minutes, 27 seconds