Episode 239: What hidden insights can customer behavior data analysis reveal about how successful one food delivery app may be over another? Discover how analysis of externally sourced customer behavior data can fuel dramatic improvements in revenue forecasts and strategic decisions. See how competitor data analysis can help identify strengths and weaknesses that are otherwise hidden. In this episode of Customer Confidential, we’re joined by Dan McCarthy, director and co-founder of Theta and Associate Professor of Marketing at the University of Maryland's Robert H. Smith School of Business. Dan shares findings from Theta and Bain & Company’s jointly published consumer purchase data study, “Customer Lifetime Value across Food Delivery Competitors.” Together, Dan and Rob explore how they used a proprietary database of credit card transaction data from Pyxis to track customer behavior for subscription services over five years. They describe how accounting for corresponding economic factors like seasonality and the Covid-19 pandemic helped improve forecasts of transaction velocity, spending, and retention. Learn which food delivery app had the best customer loyalty, the most customers, and highest per-customer spending. Guest: Dan McCarthy, Director and Co-Founder of Theta, Associate Professor of Marketing at the University of Maryland, College Park Host: Rob Markey, Partner, Bain & Company Give Us Feedback: We’d love to hear from you. Help us enhance your podcast experience by providing feedback here in our listener survey. Want to get in touch? Send a note to host Rob Markey here. Time-Stamped List of Topics Covered: [02:00] Introduction to customer behavior analysis and business forecasting [05:15] How companies can use historical data to predict customer lifetime value [10:00] Insights from customer data and the role of subscription services [15:30] The impact of external factors like economic shifts and market changes on consumer behavior [20:00] How businesses can improve acquisition and retention strategies using data [25:00] Using customer lifetime value to forecast future revenue and business growth Time-Stamped Notable Quotes: [02:45] “The notion of having a consistent data set with multiple companies in it so you can compare … all these different food delivery companies [means] you can explicitly see them and you can see the same consumers buying across them.” [05:37] “It’s primarily taking these different vintages of customers—where a vintage is defined by, ‘When did that customer make their very first purchase with your firm?’—and then within that vintage, what we want to explain is what these individual customers are going to do in the future.” [07:42] “[The data] is what allows us to say things like, is this company acquiring customers well? Are they retaining customers well? How frequently are they buying? And how does that compare across different companies?” Additional Resources: Customer Lifetime Value across Food Delivery Competitors Pyxis by Bain & Company

Episode 238: In what appears to be a paradox, Verizon is accelerating its responsible AI journey through a measured, deliberate approach—ensuring its technology is primed to enhance customer experiences when they matter most. Verizon isn’t rushing to put AI in front of customers. Instead, they’re deliberately building trust, refining data quality, and rigorously testing their AI tools internally. This methodical strategy might seem slow, but is accelerating their progress toward a future where AI can take on a bigger, more direct, customer-serving role. In this episode, Brian Higgins, chief customer experience officer at Verizon, explains how their thoughtful AI tool development empowers and supports employees today while laying the groundwork for handling more customer interactions tomorrow. Tools like the Personal Research Assistant are being refined internally, allowing Verizon employees to build confidence in AI’s capabilities before these technologies ever touch a customer. According to Brian, Verizon has focused on “bringing humans and AI together to drive more yield.” By ensuring employees are comfortable and proficient with AI tools, Verizon is building a strong AI foundation. His team embraces a deliberate learning approach vs. rushing to deploy technology for its own sake. Learn more about Verizon’s AI strategy and how building trustworthy internal tools enables smarter, faster, and more personalized customer experiences at scale. Guest: Brian Higgins, Chief Customer Experience Officer, Verizon Host: Rob Markey, Partner, Bain & Company Give Us Feedback: We’d love to hear from you. Help us enhance your podcast experience by providing feedback here in our listener survey. Want to get in touch? Send a note to host Rob Markey: https://www.robmarkey.com/contact-rob Time-stamped List of Topics Covered: [02:15] How Verizon uses AI to empower employees and streamline operations [07:05] The strategy behind building AI tools like Verizon’s Personal Research Assistant [12:45] Employee co-development and involvement in AI-driven transformations [19:30] Balancing short-term wins with long-term AI-driven business goals [25:50] Leadership commitment and the role of AI in transforming customer experience Time-stamped Notable Quotes: [02:45] “Customers don't only go into a store. They don't only go to verizon.com. They go all over the place and do all kinds of things with us all the time. You have to pull all that together into one view.” [03:46]  “If the employees aren't happy with their overall experience, it's virtually impossible for them to make the customers happy.” [05:30] “This is another tool in the toolbox, and the employees see [AI’s value] right away.” [11:15] “We had to reorganize everything ... but you can't simply go back to what you were doing before. You [have] to layer in something new.” [22:45] “Our primary focus was on areas of pain for both employees and customers.” [27:21] “This is about bringing humans and AI together to drive more yield. If we were a declining business, it might have a different model. But we're not a declining business. We're a growing business. We need to get more out of the current employees we have.” [32:25] “Personalization is the material unlock—for us and our customers.” [38:32] “We had some challenging times for a few years at Verizon. There was a recognition that we needed to reorganize how the whole company was structured. And we did that.”

How does democratizing intelligence enhance productivity and drive smarter decision-making? Murli Buluswar, Citigroup’s Head of Analytics for the US Personal Bank, joins host Rob Markey to explore Citi’s strategies for democratizing intelligence. Murli emphasizes building a conversational intelligence platform that enables proactive and reactive insights to reduce friction between curiosity, insight, and decision-making. This approach enhances organizational efficiency, boosts productivity, and sparks more complex problem-solving. Taking an NPS-based scientific approach, Citi treats customer experience as a key growth strategy. Murli shares how small improvements in customer experience can boost long-term retention and how investing in marketing to existing customers offers quick returns. Citi's in-house Journey Analytics engine integrates financial transactions, customer information, external data, and internal algorithms to identify opportunities that enhance the customer experience. This innovative approach to decision-making—a mere dream five years ago—is now a reality, delivering significant customer value and better business results. Guest: Murli Buluswar, Head of Analytics, US Personal Banking, Citigroup  Host: Rob Markey, Partner, Bain & Company Give Us Feedback: We’d love to hear from you. Help us enhance your podcast experience by providing feedback here in our listener survey. Want to get in touch? Send a note to host Rob Markey: https://www.robmarkey.com/contact-rob Time-stamped list of topics covered: (1:07) High-level business overview for context (1:53) The democratization of intelligence (4:49) Clarifying Murli’s role vs. that of a chief data and analytics officer (6:25) The transformation and aggregation of disaggregated teams within Citi—and the need for a global solution (11:42) Customer health index (19:59) Framework to examine actions, forecast outcomes, and bring more intentionality to decision-making (32:30) Automated aberration detection (37:25) Career reflections and parting thoughts Time-stamped list of notable quotes (4:21) “We are building a conversational intelligence platform that allows people to interact with data. There's both the proactive identification of things we might not have conceptualized. And there's the—dare I say—reactive component of, ‘I have a question and I want to ask the engine.’” (6:00) “That's why this notion of democratization of intelligence is important to me. If I can enable the organization to whet its curiosity and its appetite independently, and then rely on my team as we get to the third and fourth layer of sophistication, then I've improved productivity and have freed up time and energy to focus on higher-order problem-solving.” (7:19) “Perhaps about 80% of the team was focused on followership, 20% on partnership, and maybe essentially next to 0% on leadership.” (10:30) “We ended up building a software tool that essentially democratized decision-making across finance, product marketing, and my team.”

Episode 236: When telecom rivals offered lower rates and bigger networks, Macquarie bet big on customer loyalty—and won. David Tudehope, Macquarie Technology Group’s CEO, joins Rob Markey to discuss Macquarie’s competitive differentiator: a bold, customer-centric approach. David co-founded Macquarie to prioritize exceptional customer experience over price and network quality competition. Joining David is Joseph Michelli, author of Customer Magic: The Macquarie Way, who shares a key moment about how a product launch was postponed and short-term profits were sacrificed due to customer need misalignment. "We weren't living our purpose if we proceeded. We had to take our medicine and accept stakeholder disappointment," David recalls. That leadership decision reinforced Macquarie's culture. Transparency and real-time feedback improved employer-customer interactions, workforce engagement, and Net Promoter Scores. Sharing real, exceptional service examples inspired employees to excel when creating memorable customer experiences. Impressive results include exceptional shareholder returns and consistently having Australian telecom’s lowest per-customer complaint volume. Guests: David Tudehope, CEO of Macquarie Technology Group, and Joseph Michelli, Ph.D., author of Customer Magic: The Macquarie Way Host: Rob Markey, Partner, Bain & Company Give Us Feedback: We’d love to hear from you. Help us enhance your podcast experience by providing feedback here in our listener survey. Want to get in touch? Send a note to host Rob Markey: https://www.robmarkey.com/contact-rob Time-stamped list of topics covered: (00:00:13 - 00:01:12) Identifying market opportunities by recognizing underserved and overcharged segments in telecom (00:01:12 - 00:03:09) Initial business strategy to develop a better billing system and the importance of customer experience (00:03:03 - 00:04:54) Customer experience as a core value and how making tough decisions helps prioritize customer satisfaction (00:04:54 - 00:06:33) Navigating industry competition and differentiating through customer service in a price-focused market (00:06:28 - 00:12:06) Empowering employees with transparency, real-time feedback, and engagement strategies (00:12:18 - 00:18:19) Overcoming challenges like billing complaints and learning from feedback (00:18:19 - 00:26:28) Cultural reinforcement and how storytelling can inspire employees (00:26:19 - 00:28:12) Continuous improvement in NPS through cultural shifts (00:28:15 - 00:31:32) Self-propelled learning and institutional growth and how to develop a sustainable model for continuous improvement Time-stamped list of notable quotes: (00:05:55) "The customer experience is the compass from which we make hard decisions.” (00:05:43) "Our purpose is making a difference for customers that are underserved and overcharged." (00:8:09) "Macquarie has between zero and two complaints a year." (00:17:03) "Our real-time feedback of customer experience scores to staff has been very powerful." (00:17:38) "When we took our hands off the big levers, we actually got significant change." (00:34:42) "We found that when we educated the person on their bill, they became an advocate for us." (00:30:21) "Storytelling has been transformational for our business." (00:35:55) "Our model is self-learning and self-propelled, and it has been that way for 10 years." Additional Resources: Read Joseph Michelli’s book: Customer Magic: The Macquarie Way

Episode 235: In 2012, T-Mobile lost nearly two million customers. Its revenue fell precipitously. Its situation seemed hopeless. Then came a new CEO with an audacious plan and a penchant for F-bombs. Jon Freier, president of T-Mobile’s US Consumer Group, joins host Rob Markey to share his firsthand account of the remarkable corporate turnaround. Jon describes the “Un-carrier” strategy, from its risky beginnings to its industry-reshaping impact. He shares how T-Mobile broke the mold, challenged conventions, and ultimately won over customers by putting their needs first. According to Jon, “The whole premise of the Un-carrier movement was about fixing a stupid, broken, arrogant industry.” Under the leadership of new CEO John Legere, T-Mobile used data-driven insights to uncover the “bad profits” that dominated the mobile telecom industry in the US at the time. Determined to not only turn the company around but to change the industry, T-Mobile made a huge bet on customer value and what we at Bain now call Earned Growth: the idea that forgoing bad profits to deliver more value to customers would not only reduce churn but ultimately attract new customers through word of mouth. Jon shares some of T-Mobile’s biggest game-changing innovations. He lays out bets on dramatic changes to handset pricing and contract renewal terms, a daring move from high-priced “buckets” of limited data to unlimited plans, repricing international roaming, and the innovative T-Mobile Tuesdays rewards program. He also highlights the impact of the “Team of Experts” customer service model. The results have been eye-popping. T-Mobile reestablished customer growth, received the highest ranking in the telecommunications & media Internet sector regarding NPS rankings (as measured by Bain’s NPS Prism telecom benchmarking), and has outperformed the stock market by many multiples. Guest: Jon Freier, President, T-Mobile US Consumer Group Host: Rob Markey, Partner, Bain & Company Give us feedback: We’d love to hear from you. Help us enhance your podcast experience by providing feedback here in our listener survey. Want to get in touch? Send a note to host Rob Markey: https://www.robmarkey.com/contact-rob Additional resources: T-Mobile’s CEO on Winning Market Share by Trash-Talking Rivals Reinventing Customer Service: How T-Mobile achieved record levels of quality and productivity Un-carrier History Learn about Bain’s NPS Prism Time-stamped list of topics covered: [2:29] The dire state of T-Mobile in 2012 [6:00] John Legere’s arrival and the birth of the “Un-carrier” strategy [10:36] Breaking down the old telecom model: from contracts to transparency [16:28] Early signs of success and the importance of leading indicators [19:17] Overcoming internal skepticism and building organizational buy-in [21:51] T-Mobile’s unique approach to customer service and the “Team of Experts” [24:27] Using data to anticipate customer needs and personalize experiences [28:14] Frontline Connect: Immersing leaders in the customer experience [30:12] T-Mobile’s winning loyalty plays: unlimited data, T-Mobile Tuesdays, and Simple Global [33:27] Lessons learned and the future of customer loyalty in telecom Time-stamped list of notable quotes: [3:14] “We were losing two million customers a year … Revenues were going down, costs were going up, and earnings were plummeting.” [3:40] “Hopeless, that would be the word I would use in 2012. We’re just stuck.” [5:59] “In walks a new CEO named John Legere ... dropping F-bombs in a very large all-employee meeting, and you’re like, ‘Did he just say what I thought he just said?’” [12:21] “If you treat customers great and you treat them better than your competitors, guess what? They’ll stay.” [14:31] “The biggest risk is doing exactly the same [thing]. Where our business was, it needed a bold shakeup.” [15:28] “You might not have to be perfect right out of the gate, but you have to be absolutely committed to steering decisions … That’s where the visibility of metrics and the overall management system is critical to be able to steer to the outcomes you’re looking for.” [16:07] “We just decided to have customers win first. Our employees win second, and then our shareholders ultimately winning after that.” [29:19] “I have the saying, at T-Mobile, that there’s two types of people. One, those who serve customers. And two, those who serve those who serve customers. And you’re in one of those two buckets. And if you don’t buy into the culture, you’ll never find the time to do it.”

Why do some retailers excel at creating a welcoming environment for a diverse customer base while others fall short? Bain & Company's Naiara De León and Madison Dyal Anderson discuss their research on how companies that excel in customer advocacy and inclusion consistently outperform their peers by a staggering 10 percentage points annually. Beyond quantifying inclusion's sizable revenue impact, they also share data from their survey of over 7,700 US consumers on the lasting negative psychological toll exclusion has on retail customers—and why one bad experience can turn someone off a brand forever. We analyze the root of the issue: What causes consumer exclusion in the first place? We also share examples of companies’ winning inclusive strategies, from the importance of eye contact to plentiful product assortment to purposefully designed campaigns. Guest: Naiara De León, Partner, Bain & Company Guest: Madison Dyal Anderson, Partner, Bain & Company Host: Rob Markey, Partner, Bain & Company Give Us Feedback: We’d love to hear from you. Help us enhance your podcast experience by providing feedback here in our listener survey. Want to get in touch? Send a note to host Rob Markey: https://www.robmarkey.com/contact-rob Time-stamped list of topics covered: [3:30] Research study overview and key findings [6:33] Research findings on how inclusion is universally important [8:02] Personal experiences of feeling welcomed or excluded in different stores [10:13] Balancing inclusivity with a retail brand’s target market [12:16] How the feeling of belonging or being welcomed affects customer advocacy [13:04] Types of negative retail experiences that lead to customer detractors [15:00] The subtleties of interaction that affect customer perceptions of inclusion [20:14] Examples of companies that have created welcoming and inclusive atmospheres [22:10] How product assortments and staff training contribute to inclusivity [26:32] How retailers can assess and improve their levels of inclusivity for good [30:54] The greater impact of inclusive practices on strategy and market position Time-stamped list of notable quotes: [00:32] “There is this line between welcomed and belonging. The core customer needs to feel like they belong.” [2:24] “Universally, customers across all demographics desire to feel invited and welcomed.” [6:33] “Inclusion matters to everyone. It's actually pretty universal.” [10:34] “The core customer needs to feel like they belong. That's where you are tuning in to those behaviors and those customer segment needs and wants. Make people feel heard and seen.” [14:45] “[In terms of survey findings, there were] verbatims that talked about, ‘The store associate never made eye contact with me. I have hearing loss and that made [communication] very hard. English is not my first language and I need that eye contact to carry all the way through [a conversation].” [31:13] “It is quite profitable to [prioritize inclusivity] because it helps you grow. It helps you lead, versus your peers. It’s also the right thing to do.” Additional Resources: Read Madison and Naiara’s Bain research, In Retail, Inclusive Customer Journeys Lead to Growth

What if the key to creating truly innovative products and solutions lies at least as much in uncovering the deep emotional and attitudinal needs of your customers as in mastering technology? Eckhart Boehme, founder and managing director of Unipro Solutions, shares his approach to putting Clayton Christensen’s Jobs to Be Done framework into practical use. Eckhart demonstrates how in-depth interviews with customers and their families can reveal the underlying personal experiences, emotions, and desires that truly motivate people to seek out and purchase products or services. With these insights in hand, companies often uncover fundamentally different needs than they first anticipated, sometimes even opening up new markets or uses for their products. We also discuss Eckhart’s Wheel of Progress model, which he designed to reveal the hidden layers of reasoning behind customer decisions. It provides a systematic way to deconstruct customer narratives and identify the jobs that are most likely to drive customer decisions along their cyclical journeys. Learn how this model segments the customer journey into phases of motivation, decision-making, and action. He brings this all to life with a compelling case study about finding a senior living place for an elderly loved one, revealing a hidden but critical job to be done: giving the elderly parent a sense of purpose. Our conversation also lays bare some common pitfalls when applying the Jobs to Be Done framework, such as focusing too narrowly on functional jobs while missing the bigger picture of the customer's overarching goals and emotional needs. Guest: Eckhart Boehme, Founder and Managing Director, Unipro Solutions Host: Rob Markey, Partner, Bain & Company Give Us Feedback: We’d love to hear from you. Help us enhance your podcast experience by providing feedback here in our listener survey. Want to get in touch? Send a note to host Rob Markey: https://www.robmarkey.com/contact-rob Time-stamped list of topics covered [1:19] How Jobs to Be Done goes deeper than traditional customer needs analysis [3:02] Clarifying what Jobs to Be Done entails and why it’s a game changer [6:08] The Wheel of Progress model and its role in dissecting customer decisions [10:41] Applying Jobs to Be Done in complex customer service scenarios [15:00] The practical steps and challenges in implementing this framework [20:14] Examples of transformative customer insights derived from in-depth interviews [22:10] Strategies for businesses to effectively harness Jobs to Be Done [30:54] Future trends and directions in customer experience research Time-stamped list of notable quotes: [6:26] “You want to understand where the story starts. What [event] triggered people [wanting to conduct] research and go through pain. Understanding what triggers people have is very valuable because then you can start building a relationship—even before people have started going to a search engine to look for a solution." [7:51] “When we look at the customer journey, we call it ‘the cycle of progress’ because we think that people make progress in cycles." [16:01] "We try to design our offerings and the marketing and sales processes to focus on helping customers make progress.” [24:23] “Jobs to Be Done helps you to do the right thing and design thinking helps you to do things right." Additional Resources: Learn more about Eckhart’s Wheel of Progress Learn more about HBS professor Clay Christensen’s Jobs to Be Done Theory and his famous story about how to improve milkshake sales

Episode 232: When AI Shifts the Balance of Power to Consumers: Preparing for a New Business Reality Matt Harris, Partner at Bain Capital Ventures, argues that generative AI will soon empower customers in unexpected ways. Consumers, he predicts, will soon use AI tools to continuously discover lower loan rates, higher-yield savings accounts, or more attractive insurance policies. As a result, Matt anticipates a shift in customer-company power dynamics. Imagine, for example, an AI agent able to continuously move your deposits to the highest-yielding savings accounts or refinance your loans to the best available rates with little intervention required from you. Imagine consumer tools for interpreting medical scans and providing a diagnosis to compare to your doctor's assessment. Generative AI could even transform the future of mental health therapy to be more effective, efficient, and streamlined. Join us as we discuss the present and future of consumers' newfound AI-driven power and analyze where organizations and their leaders should be pointed next to remain competitive. Guest: Matt Harris, Partner, Bain Capital Ventures Host: Rob Markey, Partner, Bain & Company Give Us Feedback: We’d love to hear from you. Help us enhance your podcast experience by providing feedback here in our listener survey. Want to get in touch? Send a note to host Rob Markey: https://www.robmarkey.com/contact-rob Time-stamped list of topics covered: [02:53] How businesses use generative AI for productivity and future innovation [09:23] Discussion on the Gartner Hype Cycle for generative AI [17:09] What it means for customers to be “superpowered” and an overview of a few generative AI applications in finance and medicine [22:28] AI's impact on society and the future of work [27:44] Adapting to a world with superpowered customers who now demand more from businesses, emphasizing the need for deepened customer relationships and greater levels of innovation Time-stamped list of notable quotes: [10:55] "Every new technology experiences [influx and they] disillusion the rest of the market because they have these spectacular failures.” [14:20] “[Generative AI] is a much more powerful tool for customers than it is for companies. And an equal or larger part of energy should be going in these boardrooms to imagining a world where customers have the power of generative AI and the implications for your entire business model.” [18:00] “I revere doctors. But how could we expect that a single human being would have all of the medical knowledge in their head? This is something computers will be better at.” [22:16] "I think I could make an argument that generative AI, combined with predictive machine learning, and being moved forward as fast as these technologies are advancing, will be better at almost everything.” [27:53] “We should be spending as much energy thinking and worrying and planning for a ‘superpowered’ customer world as we are thinking about how we use [technology] ourselves, and I’m just not seeing people doing that.” Additional Resources: Read Matt’s article for BCV, The Age of the Superpowered Customer The Age of AI and Our Human Future by Henry A. Kissinger, Eric Schmidt, and Daniel Huttenlocher The AI Advantage by Thomas H. Davenport Prediction Machines by Ajay Agrawal, Joshua Gans, and Avi Goldfarb Learn about Bain’s spin-off, Bain Capital, which has operated as a separate company since 1984 Learn More About Our Guest and Host: Guest: Matt Harris LinkedIn Profile Host: Rob Markey LinkedIn Profile

Discover the engine of Earned Growth as Rob Markey and Fred Reichheld, Bain Fellow and "Winning On Purpose” author, hold a working session on how references and referrals significantly contribute to organic growth. Rob and Fred unearth the pivotal role that references and referrals play in propelling Earned Growth. They answer key questions such as: How would you characterize different referral types? What are the best mechanisms for measuring and attributing value to them? How do you navigate the tricky path of fostering genuine, organic referrals at scale? Together, they explore one of the thorniest issues in accounting for the value of referrals: How much of a new referred customer’s value should accrue to the referring customer versus the referred one? Guest: Fred Reichheld, Bain Fellow, founder of Bain's Loyalty Practice Host: Rob Markey, Partner, Bain & Company Time-stamped list of topics covered: 02:00 - Unveiling the Referral Spectrum 08:30 - Measuring the Impact of Referrals 15:45 - Attributing Value: Who Benefits? 22:10 - Fostering a Culture of Earned Growth Time-stamped list of notable quotes: 02:25 - Rob Markey: "A genuine referral, an authentic referral, is motivated by some form of goodwill towards the recipient." 05:45 - Fred Reichheld: "Earned Growth is not just a metric, it's a philosophy." 19:30 - Fred Reichheld: "The value of a referral is the cornerstone of organic expansion.” Additional Resources: Winning On Purpose by Fred Reichheld Bain & Company’s Insights on Earned Growth Guest and Host Bio Links: Fred Reichheld LinkedIn Profile Rob Markey LinkedIn Profile Give Us Feedback: Help us enhance your podcast experience by providing feedback here. Send a note to host Rob Markey: https://www.robmarkey.com/contact-rob

Why would a world-class sports academy invest in a student center, rather than more coaches, fancy equipment, or dorms? IMG Academy, a Florida boarding school, turns out some of the most successful college and professional athletes around. Its president, Tim Pernetti, led a massive cultural shift toward customer loyalty. Tim says IMG Academy used to be highly focused on coaching and sports operations. To be clear, that emphasis on athletic excellence helped produce a large number of highly successful athletes. But Tim and the leadership team saw the potential to add something on top of this: a focus on serving a more comprehensive set of student-athlete needs. Today, IMG Academy leverages student-athlete input to refine its program and operations. New initiatives range from enhancing dining experiences to introducing flexible communal spaces. Tim shares how an emphasis on employee recognition combines regular student and parent feedback to instill deep, enduring culture change. Guest: Tim Pernetti, President, IMG Academy Host: Rob Markey, Partner, Bain & Company Time-stamped list of topics covered: [00:09:17] Global influence and expansion [00:14:25] Culture shift toward experience [00:19:57] Response to student feedback [00:25:32] Investment in campus experience [00:30:01] Recognition's impact on staff [00:35:23] Challenges in universal buy-in [00:37:09] Commitment to improving IMG Academy Time-stamped list of notable quotes: [00:04:43] “Really, [our early] focus was on intense physical training, like total immersion in tennis. And the result was ten world number ones [were trained here].” [00:07:23] “This is an environment where you're bringing people in from all over the world. You want to have good people in the environment. We put a lot of weight into that, like getting to know kids, and getting to know their parents.” [00:23:17] “We went into meetings with data and said, ‘Here’s what the customer is saying.’” [00:29:16] “[At] a place like IMG Academy, we have everything from coaches, people that serve food every day, and our transportation drivers, [and people] who cut the grass at five o'clock in the morning. And I've shadowed all of them." [00:30:12] “We [recognized a tram driver] with a financial bonus and a gift card to take his wife out to dinner. This guy now is known as the friendliest, nicest, most outgoing person on campus.” [00:30:35] "The biggest tool you have in your toolkit right now is your personal and other leaders' acknowledgment and recognition when people do the right things.” Guest and Host Bio Links: Tim Pernetti's LinkedIn Profile Rob Markey LinkedIn Profile Give Us Feedback: Help us enhance your podcast experience by providing feedback here. Send a note to host Rob Markey: https://www.robmarkey.com/contact-rob

How can businesses transcend traditional customer service boundaries to establish new customer experience benchmarks? Stan Swinton, Founder and General Manager of NPSx, Bain & Company, discusses how a comprehensive approach to customer experience extends beyond gathering feedback or managing customer journeys. Stan details Bain’s NPSx framework—comparable to a restaurant star rating, he says—which offers an extensive customer-centricity analysis via 60+ dimensions and eight pillars. Stan shares how this methodology motivates companies to strive for top-tier customer satisfaction. We also discuss the Customer Experience Roadmap and Accreditation (CXRA). Stan highlights CXRA's effectiveness in uncovering inefficiencies and enhancing customer-employee synergies. In addition, we explore why businesses frequently restrict their customer experience initiatives to areas such as feedback management, and discuss the essential role of Customer Experience Officers in achieving genuine customer centricity. Finally, we examine the constantly changing landscape of CX benchmarks and expectations, emphasizing the importance of a flexible and adaptive approach. Guest: Stan Swinton, Founder and General Manager of NPSx, Bain & Company Host: Rob Markey, Partner, Bain & Company Time-stamped list of topics covered: [16:56] Role of CX: Stan highlights how the NPSx framework aids in defining company decision rights and categorizes 60 different jobs or dimensions to be coordinated. [17:50] Framework Pillars: Eight pillars provide a structured context for internal dialogue on improvement within organizations. [18:15] Framework applicability: The framework's relevance, even for companies that are just starting their CX journey or are less mature in their CX programs [19:19] Framework evolution and review: The living nature of the framework, with ongoing revisions and updates to standards and maturity scales to keep pace with current trends in customer centricity [20:10] Benchmarking and improvement: How clients sometimes feel dissatisfied with their initial ratings but are encouraged to view it as a journey toward improvement, similar to achieving restaurant rating stars in the culinary world [21:48] Identifying opportunities: How the framework allows organizations to identify their strengths and areas for improvement in customer experience Time-stamped list of notable quotes: [04:49] “We would generally work with a company first to define their taxonomy. One of the things we recognize is a lot of different industries and clients have different ways of defining their experiences. But there are standards and there are best practices that we can bring to the table to help shape that taxonomy and definitions.” [7:28] “One of the things that we recognize at Bain is that a lot of practitioners didn't come from a CX background. There aren't a lot of degree programs dedicated to CX. And when we were looking at the market, we’d say, well, how can you train yourself as a CX practitioner?” [12:31] “Our framework has eight pillars: purpose and leadership, proposition management, customer value and lifecycle management, customer journey management, customer service management, customer feedback management, customer data management, and employee experience.” Additional Resources: Bain article | The Elements of Value: Understanding the 30 elements of value for consumers can help companies gain an edge. HBR article | The Elements of Value: Measuring—and delivering—what consumers really want Guest and Host Bio Links: Stan’s LinkedIn profile Rob Markey LinkedIn Profile Give Us Feedback: Help us enhance your podcast experience by providing feedback here. Send a note to host Rob Markey: https://www.robmarkey.com/contact-rob

How does a global medical technology company maintain customer focus while managing operational challenges during a pandemic? In this episode, Tony Ezell, executive vice president of North America and chief marketing officer for Becton, Dickinson and Company (BD), explores how integrating customer feedback into your business strategy can maintain—and even enhance—customer loyalty by helping shape business strategies that are both robust and responsive to evolving customer needs. Tony outlines how customer loyalty and adaptability are essential strategic tools in healthcare innovation. Together, we explore how BD leveraged a customer-centric approach to skillfully navigate operational continuity and customer satisfaction. We also take a short trip down memory lane to connect the dots from our chat with Tony a decade ago, exploring the ongoing impact of customer experience and Net Promoter Systems on Tony's evolving career trajectory and leadership style. Guest: Tony Ezell, executive vice president of North America and chief marketing officer, Becton, Dickinson and Company Episode Highlights Introduction and Tony Ezell's background [01:59] The balance of operational responsibilities and customer-centricity [04:53] Covid-19’s impact on customer loyalty at BD [05:50] Implementing customer feedback into business strategy [09:09] BD’s challenges and opportunities [12:09] Tony’s NPS work [15:07] Customer feedback scores [20:07] Partnerships [21:30] Connecting the dots between 2014 and today [26:22] Driving loyalty [27:46] Quotable Quotes: "We have customers who were starting to decide whether they want to go away from us, who are now calling us to engage, to help them solve their problems again.” [01:19] “I always think about what drives loyalty, and do we know what drives loyalty? And are we actually delivering on the things that matter most to our customers, that drive loyalty? And that’s what we’re operating on now.” [04:33] “Our customers see us as one company, not as seven or nine different businesses. And now that we’ve done that, we’re starting to make improvements.” [12:38] Additional Resources: Hear Tony’s 2014 podcast with Rob Markey: “Breaking Down the ‘Invisible Fence’” Host: Rob Markey Get in touch: Send us your podcast feedback here. Send Rob a note here.

How does an insurance industry leader integrate a simple yet profound question—Would you do that to your mom?—to transform customer service and decision making? In this episode, Richard Watts, board member at Farmers Insurance and former sales and service president at Progressive, discusses how asking this question improves business operations. He explores how this unique approach revolutionizes customer service and sets a new industry standard for empathy and customer focus. Richard also shares insights into how this philosophy transformed internal practices, significantly influenced customer satisfaction and loyalty, and how it continues to shape his leadership and strategic decisions. We'll also revisit Richard's journey from biology to computer science and his shift toward customer-centric innovations in insurance. Guest: Richard Watts, board member, Farmers Insurance Episode Highlights Introduction and background [02:05] The genesis of the "Would You Do That to Your Mom?" philosophy [05:10] Reflections on the evolution of customer service in insurance [11:25] How empathy drives customer loyalty and business success [14:15] Challenges and triumphs in embedding this into organizational culture [18:30] The ongoing influence of this approach in Richard's career [22:45] Balancing data-driven strategies with ethical considerations [25:50] Quotable Quotes: “There isn't a single business initiative or change program that people don't say has to be CEO-led or have the CEO's blessing.” [21:19] “Having someone out there to take the machete and, hack through the jungle of all these processes, being able to go there and say, ‘Okay, we need real-time processing. We can't live with these batch systems anymore.” [22:30] Host: Rob Markey Get in touch: Send us your podcast feedback here. Send Rob a note here.

How do the needs of students at for-profit, mostly online colleges differ from those of typical college students? They often require financial aid, schedule flexibility, and academic support that can go far beyond the norm of traditional higher education. In this segment, we explore why graduation rates have traditionally been quite low at these colleges due to all the challenges students face. How do schools like this strike an appropriate balance of flexibility, support, and rigorous academic programs that will help their students succeed in the workforce? Ruth Veloria is the chief strategy officer and customer officer at the University of Phoenix. She is on a mission to help more of the school’s students successfully overcome challenges so they can complete their studies and reap the rewards of their education. Ruth and the team at University of Phoenix have spent over a decade working to improve student retention and success rates. In this episode, roughly a decade after Ruth first joined Rob on the podcast, she shares how the University of Phoenix has achieved a remarkable increase in student retention rates, from 64% to 74%. They now graduate over a third more students than they did 10 years ago. Ruth discusses how the Net Promoter System helped fuel the university’s deep commitment to learning from and acting on student feedback. She describes academic policies that are empathetic versus unempathetic, and how data analysis and feedback have been used to enhance student experience and to support policy and process change. Episode Highlights Overview of a subscription-like model for student enrollment [03:15] Transition of Ruth from the School of Business to strategy and customer experience leadership [07:10] Approaches to student retention and success [11:45] Utilizing data analytics and technology to improve student outcomes [16:25] Adapting to Covid-19: Impact on student experience and education delivery [20:55] Insights into student acquisition costs and orientation processes [25:30] Reflections on the implementation and evolution of the Net Promoter System [30:15] Ruth’s advice for educational transformation and future goals [35:00] Quotable Quotes: “We went from a 59 Net Promoter Score up to a 73 Net Promoter Score.” [16:33] “We created a lot of entrepreneurs. We got a lot of people excited about changes they could make in the student experience.” [24:19] “We actually set up a pilot team that was using a business leader and tech leader to come together to fix application problems. In fact, we still have that today.” [25:06] Guest: Ruth Veloria, chief strategy officer and customer officer, University of Phoenix Host: Rob Markey Get in touch: Send us your podcast feedback here. Send Rob a note here.

Episode 225: How do high-quality NPS benchmarks unlock strategic priorities and initiatives? What if your NPS data seems highly counterintuitive? For example, what if Detractors seem to be more loyal than Promoters? Host Rob Markey and Jason Barro, a partner at Bain & Company and the leader of Bain's NPS Prism benchmarking service, unpack this situation in the airline industry. It’s an illustration of how Net Promoter Score benchmark data might be misleading when not all customers have the freedom to choose, revealing the nuanced understanding required to transform raw data into strategic business insights. Jason and Rob use this example to explore some of the ways a sophisticated knowledge of how customers buy, the choices they have available, and how a market’s competitive dynamics inform the interpretation of customer loyalty benchmarks like NPS. Episode Highlights: Introduction to Jason and NPS Prism [01:02] Using NPS Data for Market Insight [02:05] Exploring the complexity of NPS in different industries [05:12] Concept of Trapped Customers [10:17] Earned Growth Strategies [23:52] Banking and Insurance Customer Dynamics [27:22] Quotable Quotes: “The more captive you are, the more likely you are to give high share of wallet to somebody that you don't like very much.” [15:53] - Rob Markey “One of the effects we see in the Prism data for airlines more broadly is that high frequent travelers are happier than low frequent travelers.” [18:06] - Jason Barro “You can see this strategy of, ‘Earn the respect and happiness of your customers,’ is a path to profitable growth, and you can see…just how much it actually matters.” - Jason Barro [23:28] Additional Resources: NPS Prism by Bain & Company Net Promoter System Overview Listen to Jason’s earlier podcast, NPS Prism: The Source for True, Deep NPS Insights Bios Jason Barro Rob Markey Get in touch: Send us your podcast feedback here. Send Rob a note here. Give us feedback.

From reshaping the playful culture of the LEGO Group to cracking the customer-centricity code in the financial services behemoth Zurich Insurance, how did Conny Kalcher manage the leap? Conny Kalcher, the group chief customer officer at Zurich Insurance, is no stranger to pioneering customer-centric transformations. After retiring from a highly successful career at the LEGO Group, where she spearheaded a customer-centric transformation, Conny brought a wave of fresh perspectives and techniques to the traditionally conservative landscape of Zurich Insurance. Her global influence extends beyond corporate corridors, marked by her active membership in Bain's NPS Loyalty Forum where she contributes to the ongoing Net Promoter System revolution. As context to today’s discussion, you may want to revisit the LEGO story she shared with host Rob Markey several years ago in podcast episode 55, Brick by Brick: Rebuilding the LEGO Group by Rediscovering Customer Centricity. In this episode, Rob sits down with Conny Kalcher—a trailblazer in customer-centric transformations—to explore her extraordinary transition from the whimsical world of LEGO to the structured realm of Zurich Insurance. Conny's approach to customer engagement transcends industry boundaries. She brings lessons developed in the playful, informal culture of the LEGO Group into a global insurance behemoth, drawing parallels and contrasts between her experiences. Conny’s anecdotes reveal that the principles of understanding and catering to customer needs are universal, whether you’re dealing with brick toys or insurance policies written in complex legalese. As Conny reminisces about her time in the toy industry, she sheds light on how the lessons learned during her tenure at the LEGO Group acted as a catalyst for nurturing a customer-first culture at Zurich Insurance. It illustrates how a keen understanding of customer sentiments can be a game-changer in any industry. Topics covered: Transition from the LEGO Group to Zurich Insurance [02:20] Customer-centric transformation [04:00] Corporate strategy and vision [06:50] Metric implementation (NPS) [07:07] Decentralized vs. centralized organizational structures [11:00] Earning customer loyalty [24:30] Quotable quotes: "Anybody who needs to change something I would definitely advise to also think about, 'How can we do processes, structures, ways of working to make people naturally change,' because people want to do the right thing, basically." [01:45] "We've defined our strategy for this strategic cycle to become the preferred insurer of our customers. So, it's all about earning the loyalty of those customers." [27:15] "My proudest moment in the Zurich [Insurance] journey is when I go to the local offices and I talk to the people there and I see the fire in their eyes, and I see the new brand on the walls, and they talk in a new kind of language that they didn’t use to talk in." [32:37] Additional resources: Zurich Insurance’s long-term strategy and near-term targets Episode 55 of Customer Confidential Podcast: Brick by Brick: Rebuilding the LEGO Group by Rediscovering Customer Centricity Net Promoter System overview Insurance industry reports by Bain & Company Bios: Conny Kalcher, group chief customer officer at Zurich Insurance Rob Markey

Host Rob Markey welcomes Mark Slatin, CEO of EmpoweredCX, to dissect the intricate dynamics of trust within customer experiences. Drawing insights from real-world examples, they explore the role of product and service quality in establishing trust, the impact of reliability and consistency in decision making, and the potential pitfalls of self-orientation. Delving deeper into the Trust Equation and explaining its different facets, Mark underscores the necessity of understanding the customer’s journey and perspective. They address the challenges of reliability, targeted marketing implications, customer vs. company centricity, the art of meaningful recommendations, and more. And they explore how to balance customer needs with shareholder expectations. Mark also provides an analytical perspective on the integral components of trust in a business landscape. In this show, Rob and Mark discuss the Trust Equation, which you can learn more about here: https://trustedadvisor.com/why-trust-matters/understanding-trust/understanding-the-trust-equation  https://modelthinkers.com/mental-model/trust-equation Guest: Mark Slatin, CEO of EmpoweredCX

In this episode, we launch our new show name: The Customer Confidential Podcast. We chose it after seeking lots of listener and guest input and believe that the new name better reflects the show’s mission—namely, to delve into untold stories of customer and industry transformations, sharing the journeys of both well-known and unsung heroes of customer centricity. We also seek out deep conversations with the thought leaders who inspire the best practitioners.  Also, in this episode, which also marks our 10th anniversary, host Rob Markey welcomes back frequent guest (and Rob’s longtime mentor) Fred Reichheld, Bain fellow and founder of Bain's Loyalty practice. Rob and Fred trace the evolution of Fred’s earned growth rate concept from its roots in Fred’s early work on customer retention at Bain. They unravel the intricacies of customer-centric metrics and how they have changed. They note the impact of genuine referrals vs. those that are bought and differentiate between earned and purchased growth. Importantly, they acknowledge and explore challenges in quantifying earned growth and how some companies have begun to tackle them successfully. Guest: Fred Reichheld, Bain fellow, founder of Bain’s Loyalty practice, and author of Winning on Purpose: The Unbeatable Strategy of Loving Customers

How do you measure patient experience and empathy within the healthcare industry in a way that truly captures real emotion and real experiences? Dr. Adrienne Boissy, guest staff neurologist at Cleveland Clinic and chief medical officer at Qualtrics, sits down with Rob Markey to discuss the need for a more comprehensive approach to capturing the patient experience. She also shares how healthcare professionals and caregivers alike can leverage compassion and self-empathy to better manage the often hard-to-handle career moments such as helping colleagues, patients, and their families process challenges together. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here.  If you’d like to learn more about Adrienne, visit her LinkedIn.

How can an organization’s passion for high-quality culinary delights forge unbreakable customer bonds? For food wholesaler METRO’s customers, buying food is a personal experience. It’s the art of witnessing, inhaling, savoring, and examining the produce, meat, and fish in the store—a sensory feast that leaves customers’ hearts full. Creating exceptional fresh-food buying experiences is METRO’s mission. In this episode, guest Peter Gries, customer and sales officer at METRO, and Rob Markey discuss why the company values its diverse customer segments. Peter also shares an insider’s perspective on the change journey transforming the company’s relationship with its customers. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here.  If you’d like to learn more about Peter, you can find him on LinkedIn.

With an array of streaming platforms and the same amount of time in the day, getting an accurate read on where your customers spend their screen time has never been more important. And this shift in customer behavior has been particularly challenging for companies that rely on traditional ways to collect data on their customers. In this episode, guest David Kenny, chairman and CEO of Nielsen, and Rob Markey discuss the impact streaming has had on Nielsen’s business, how the company is evolving to meet new challenges, and how strategic innovation fosters customer trust. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here.  If you’d like to learn more about David, you can find him on LinkedIn.

In a digital-first environment, successful brands stay ahead of the curve by prioritizing agility and experimentation. Instead of merely solving problems, they drive innovative solutions to eliminate—not just mitigate—customer pain points to achieve a seamless and exceptional customer experience. In this episode, guest Joe Wheeler, CEO of CX/Digital, and Rob Markey discuss how successful brands bridge the gap between human and digital experiences and the significance of agility and experimentation as tools for achieving successful digital transformations. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here. You can order Joe’s new book, The Digital-First Customer Experience, here. If you’d like to learn more about Joe, you can find him on LinkedIn.

What makes people recommend your brand and services to others? Winning referrals are more than just a marketing channel; they’re a way to turn prospects into lifelong customers through word-of-mouth advocacy based on authenticity and trust. In this episode, guest Andy Cockburn, CEO and cofounder of Mention Me, and Rob Markey discuss the effectiveness of trust-based referrals, how to integrate advocacy into company culture to unlock the transformative potential of referrals, and how data-driven approaches can optimize referrals’ effectiveness. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here.  If you’d like to learn more about Andy, you can find him on LinkedIn.

In this episode, Ben Reason, CEO and founder of Livework, and Rob Markey discuss how, by taking consumers’ needs and emotions into account, design can create products and services that are both functional and emotionally appealing, making consumer experiences more enjoyable. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here.  If you’d like to learn more about Ben, you can find him on LinkedIn.

How can companies get revenue forecasting and value creation right? By slowing down. Michael Mauboussin, head of Consilient Research at Counterpoint Global, Morgan Stanley Investment Management, and Rob Markey discuss the metrics and methods businesses can use to grow their long-term value. Make sure to listen to part two. ·        Get your copy of Michael’s book, Expectations Investing, here. ·        Read Michael’s Harvard Business Review article “The True Measures of Success” here. ·       Read more from Michael about the economics of customer business here. If you’d like to learn more about Michael, you can find him on LinkedIn. To offer feedback or share ideas about the show, please fill out our survey here. 

Investing in customer happiness can be the surest way to high Net Promoter Scores. But how do you accomplish that while maintaining a healthy business? Michael Mauboussin, head of Consilient Research at Counterpoint Global, Morgan Stanley Investment Management, and Rob Markey discuss how expectations investing impacts valuations and business growth. The two also share insights on how companies can build a long-term investment strategy that can withstand changes in the market while attracting and retaining loyal customers. Get your copy of Michael’s book, Expectations Investing, here. If you’d like to learn more about Michael, you can find him on LinkedIn. If you’d like to offer feedback or share ideas about the show, please fill out our survey here. 

In this episode, guest Allison Hartsoe, managing director of customer and growth at EY and author of The Age of Customer Equity, and Rob Markey discuss calculating customer lifetime value, why understanding customer behavior generates more accurate revenue forecasts, and how to develop a high-quality approach to customer equity. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here.  If you’d like to learn more about Allison, you can find her on LinkedIn.

In this episode, guest Stacy Sherman, founder of Doing CX Right, and Rob Markey discuss the importance of understanding the customer's perspective when you're trying to transform the customer experience, managing high-stakes CX for an elevator and escalator business, and why companies should consider journey mapping as a strategic tool to address consumer pain points head-on. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here.  If you’d like to learn more about Stacy, you can find her on LinkedIn.

In this episode, guest Peter Pizzi, director of customer experience and insights at Analog Devices, and Rob Markey discuss how to focus an organization on customer feedback–based actions, the role of customer experience in tackling sales challenges, and how to make sure the improvements customers are asking for make their way onto product and functional leaders’ agendas. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here. If you’d like to learn more about Peter, you can find him on LinkedIn.

In this episode, guest Andreas Heckmann, executive vice president of product engineering and head of customer solution support and innovation at SAP, and Rob Markey discuss the past, present, and future of cloud innovation as it relates to machine learning, artificial intelligence, organizational and customer challenges and opportunities, and cost savings. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here. If you’d like to learn more about Andreas, you can find him on LinkedIn.

In this episode, guest Kentaro Kawamori, CEO and cofounder of Persefoni Inc., and Rob Markey discuss the interconnection between Net Promoter Score and organizational sustainability. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here. If you’d like to learn more about Kentaro, you can find him on Linkedin. Bain & Company is an investor in Persefoni. Together, we’ve created a unique partnership combining breakthrough carbon footprint analytics with decarbonization strategy. To learn more about our partnership, visit our partnership page.

In this episode, Jason Barro, Bain & Company partner, and Rob Markey discuss NPS Prism and how it’s used across various industries to drive consumer sentiment. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here. If you’d like to learn more about Jason Barro, you can find him on LinkedIn.

In this episode, Bain Fellow Fred Reichheld and Rob Markey discuss how Earned Growth and operational indicators can provide both inspiration and learning to an organization. We also explore companies’ most common Net Promoter Score mistakes, and we participate in a live audience Q&A. Please share your feedback on the podcast here. If you’d like to learn more about Fred Reichheld, you can find him on LinkedIn. This episode was sponsored by NPSx℠, a new venture from Bain & Company that provides training, certification, technology, and community to help companies enrich their customers’ lives. Learn more at npsx.com.

In this episode, Mike Salguero, founder and CEO of ButcherBox, and Rob Markey discuss how a purpose-driven, direct-to-consumer meat subscription service aims to improve people’s health, mitigate environmental damage, and make farming more sustainable and ethical. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here. If you’d like to learn more about Mike Salguero, you can find him on LinkedIn.

In this episode, Zack Anderson, chief data and analytics officer at National Westminster Bank (NatWest), and Rob Markey discuss how garnering a deeper understanding of customers’ perspectives improves a company’s data analytics and why a more streamlined approach to extracting customer information improves client satisfaction. Zack also highlights his top strategies to ensure consumers remain responsive and satisfied with a company’s offerings, approaches, and targeted communications. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here. If you’d like to learn more about Zack Anderson you can find him on LinkedIn.

In this episode, Evan Siegel, vice president of financial services and business development at eGain, and Rob Markey discuss why customer-focused bankers need to learn how to listen to consumers’ true financial needs and wants, and why empowering consumers to take charge of their financial health wins their long-term trust. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here. If you’d like to learn more about Evan Siegel, you can find him on LinkedIn.

In this episode, Bryan Rutberg, founder and principal of 3C Communications, shares how and when to advocate on behalf of the customers you serve, and Rob Markey discusses how enhancing relationships with customers and prioritizing frontline employees' learning opportunities builds rapport vs. merely building up scores. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here. If you’d like to learn more about Bryan Rutberg, you can find him on LinkedIn. Download Bryan’s free ebook, Love & Profit: 10 Ways to Transform Customers into Lustomers, here.

In this episode, Carolyn Saunders, former senior vice president, Consumer & Small Business (Retail), International Banking, for Scotiabank and current Bain external advisor, and Rob Markey discuss how enhancing relationships with customers and prioritizing frontline employees’ learning opportunities builds rapport vs. merely building up scores. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here. If you’d like to learn more about Carolyn Saunders, you can find her on LinkedIn.

In this episode, Nate Henderson, BILT’s founder and CEO, and Rob Markey discuss how to make a great customer experience an empowering experience, how to raise Net Promoter Score℠, and how BILT leverages analytics to improve customer sentiment. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here. If you’d like to learn more about Nate Henderson, you can find him on LinkedIn.

In this episode, Ilenia Vidili, a customer-centricity adviser and author of Journey to Centricity, and Rob Markey discuss why connecting to customers means understanding what they value. When companies use their voice to stand up for something they truly believe in or to advance and improve society, customers notice. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here. If you’d like to learn more about Ilenia Vidili, you can find her on LinkedIn. Order Ilenia's book here.

In this episode, Jon Picoult, founder and principal at Watermark Consulting, and author of From Impressed to Obsessed: 12 Principles for Turning Customers and Employees into Lifelong Fans, and Rob Markey discuss why creating fewer problems for consumers drives more value interactions and how to deliver a cost-effective experience customers value long term. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here. If you’d like to learn more about Jon Picoult, you can find him on LinkedIn. Order Jon's book here.

In this episode, Barbara Higgins, former chief customer officer of Duke Energy, and Rob Markey discuss what customer loyalty in the utility industry looks like as well as Barbara's strategies and techniques to cultivate lasting trust. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here. If you’d like to learn more about Barbara Higgins, you can find her on LinkedIn.

In this episode, Dr. Jason Guardino of The Permanente Medical Group and Rob Markey discuss how healthcare organizations like Jason’s are helping physicians and care facilities create meaningful and valuable patient experiences that promote better care outcomes. If you’d like to provide feedback on the show, please fill out our survey here. If you’d like to learn more about Jason Guardino, you can find him on LinkedIn.

In the workplace, biased language and treatment can often slip by without consequence, leaving those discriminated against feeling powerless or unheard. But Just Work cofounders Trier Bryant and Kim Scott believe integrating bias disruptors in the workplace can help all who experience or observe bias speak up and address it in the moment. In this episode, Kim, Trier, and I discuss how bias disruptors can contribute to a just work environment and what leadership can do to root out and recognize bias.

Bias. We all have it. We form quick assessments of someone’s character off of their appearance alone, for instance. But those quick assessments can undermine customer and workplace relationships. What if more people were aware when bias was creeping into their perspective? In this episode, Kim, Trier, and I discuss what a “just” work environment looks like—one in which bias, prejudice, and bullying are addressed early on. And we explore how proactive leaders who encourage all employees to speak up when they see or experience bias, discrimination, or bullying can jump-start this shift.

Since its somewhat humble beginnings mailing DVDs back-and-forth with customers in red envelopes, Netflix has evolved into an iconic digital insurgent known not only for its seamless entertainment experience, but also for its award-winning studio and production output.  In this episode, Todd Yellin, vice president of product at Netflix, shares his perspective on Netflix’s history, a few of the company’s latest developments, and how customer analytics and feedback enables the company to keep raising the bar and improving the value it delivers to customers.

It seems obvious: When customers feel loved and appreciated by a company, they stay longer, buy more, and enthusiastically return. But how do you get boards and shareholders to abandon quick profits and invest in the long-term goal of customer satisfaction? In this episode of the podcast, Fred Reichheld, a Bain fellow, creator of the Net Promoter System, and author of the new book Winning on Purpose: The Unbeatable Strategy of Loving Customers, shares how leaders should be using NPS correctly to succeed in the long run.

“Love” isn’t a word you often hear in business. It seems to run counter to the calculated numbers and tedious plans crafted in many boardrooms. But in his new book Winning on Purpose: The Unbeatable Strategy of Loving Customers, Fred Reichheld, a Bain fellow and creator of the Net Promoter system of management, makes it clear: Loving your customers is the key to continued success.

It’s trendy right now for leadership teams to craft lofty statements of purpose. But Darci Darnell, a Bain partner and coauthor of the new book Winning on Purpose: The Unbeatable Strategy of Loving Customers, says the organizations that succeed in inspiring their teams with the company’s sense of purpose don’t just craft these mission statements, they help employees understand their role in these missions.

Despite the pressing challenge of digital native insurgents, incumbent companies have struggled to shift to a customer-centric strategy, fearing shrinking shareholder returns and being weighed down by operational hurdles. However, Maureen Burns, a Bain Partner and coauthor of the new book Winning on Purpose: The Unbeatable Strategy of Loving Customers, says there is no tradeoff between doing well for shareholders while still delivering for customers.

A central theme in Fred Reichheld's new book, Winning on Purpose: The Unbeatable Strategy of Loving Customers, which releases December 7, is purpose. For Fred, a well-defined company purpose is the engine that drives success. But it’s not enough. To succeed, an organization’s No. 1 goal should always be to make customers’ lives better.

After the murder of George Floyd in May 2020, USAA took a public stance on racial justice. But Tony Wells, USAA’s chief brand officer at the time, says the organization’s conversation began privately. Given the company’s history of strong internal communication and employees’ deep sense of mission, Wells believed that they were set up for successful discussions and change.

It’s tempting to attribute USAA's success to its special expertise in serving military personnel. But Tony Wells, USAA’s former chief brand officer, says it comes down to empathy for the unique challenges members face. In this episode, Tony shares how USAA lives its mission every day, how the company quickly adapted to support employees and customers in the wake of the Covid-19 pandemic, and how it continues to prepare for disruption.

Former tech executive Kara Goldin, author of the new book “Undaunted: Overcoming Doubts And Doubters,” shares the story behind Hint Water: How her quest to find an alternative to diet soda led to the creation of an entirely new type of beverage. Her story reveals how persistence and a singular focus on meeting core customer needs can result in outsized success.  

The Royal Bank of Scotland (RBS), now part of NatWest Group, is older than some of the world’s countries. For much of that time, the very essence of the bank was to put its customers first. But in more recent history, the storied bank had lost sight of that mission, says Paul Smith, director of customer insights and marketing at NatWest Group. In this episode of the Net Promoter System podcast, Paul talks about the journey back: From an old-line and challenged bank into a customer-focused organization that is now part of NatWest Group.

Few people are loyal to a body shop. Instead, people find them, literally, by accident: after a fender bender, most customers select a shop from their insurer’s direct repair program. But when Steve Grimshaw, executive chairman of Caliber Collision, first took over as CEO of the body shop company in 2009, he realized that with repair experiences often driving insurer policy renewals and most body shop business coming from insurer referrals, customer satisfaction matters a lot. 

Lori Cobb found her passion in a leadership role at Cummins Inc. that included responsibility for customer experience and insights: “I love solving problems, and I particularly enjoy solving customer problems,” she says. “And customers were hungry to have somebody just listen to what their needs are.” Today, she’s CEO of Mockingbird Ventures and a principal of AIM Advisory Services. In this episode, she shares some of the lessons she learned on her journey into customer centricity.

Darrell Rigby believes passionately that Agile is the future. “I do believe that this is the way that companies will be run going forward." His biggest fear, though, is that "there’s a lot of Agile that’s being done wrong. If we don’t fix that, then Agile is likely to turn into the next management fad.” Coauthor of a new book, Doing Agile Right, Darrell leads Bain & Company's Agile practice. He joined me to discuss how, when done right, Agile creates a culture obsessed with customer satisfaction.

Mark Robinson, president of UPS Capital, the financial services subsidiary of UPS, joins me to discuss how the adoption of the Net Promoter System at UPS Capital was turbocharged by Agile ways of working and how Agile teams were able to radically speed up needed fixes to the customer experience that frontline employee identified in their huddles.  

Some customer metrics are so good at predicting customer behavior and the value of a company’s customer base, says the Wharton School’s Peter Fader, that “any sensible investor should be demanding these kinds of metrics. And of course, any sensible executive should be obsessed over these kinds of metrics internally.” In this, the second podcast in our two-part discussion, we talk about how executives can use these same metrics to change the way they look at customer investments.

As a professor of marketing at Wharton, Peter Fader has focused most of his career on analyzing data to predict how customers will behave. He is also cofounder of Theta Equity Partners, which offers customer-based corporate valuation—a way of valuing firms based on the quality of their customer base. His most recent work, in the January/February 2020 issue of Harvard Business Review and cowritten with recent podcast guest Dan McCarthy, is called “How to Value a Company by Analyzing Its Customers.”

To provide perspective on the impact of Covid-19 in South America, Rob talks with Luiza Mattos, a Bain & Company partner based in São Paulo, Brazil. Luiza is one of Bain's customer experience, Net Promoter System and Results Delivery leaders, and she recently researched how consumers in South America have been spending their time since the start of the pandemic. She also discusses the strategies companies in the region are using to make sure their customers and employees feel connected and supported.

Stanley McChrystal, CEO of McChrystal Group, knows how to lead a dispersed team in a crisis. A retired four-star general, he commanded US and International Security Assistance Forces in Afghanistan and was the former commander of the nation's premier military counterterrorism force, the Joint Special Operations Command. He joined the podcast during the Covid-19 crisis to talk about three ways to lead through a crisis: trust, empowered execution and inspiring leadership—all underpinned by connection.

Whether we’ve been deeply, personally affected by this pandemic or are simply trying to get ourselves and our loved ones through it, we’re all sharing a version of the same experience. For customer experience professionals, that’s been a new challenge. My colleague Maureen Burns and I have seen some companies fumble it badly. But many others have tuned into the experience with empathy. They’re creating experiences and offering innovative solutions that are building a deep reservoir of trust and loyalty with customers and employees that will last long after this pandemic is a bad memory. In this episode, Maureen joined me to talk about what it is that customers and employees really need right now, and how the answer varies by company. And I also asked Maureen for her answers to some of the practical questions that Net Promoter practitioners are asking about soliciting customer feedback at a time like this.

A decade ago, when Roger Martin was dean of the Rotman School of Management at the University of Toronto, he called for a shift away from the business world’s focus on maximizing shareholder value to a new era in which value for customers and the value of customers would take primacy. He called it “The Age of Customer Capitalism.” His work had a profound impact on my thinking. Very few leaders have been able to act on his vision, but now, a decade later, the era of customer capitalism that he predicted is finally dawning.

In the second part of our conversation about customer-based corporate valuation, Dan McCarthy of Emory University’s Goizueta Business School and cofounder of Theta Equity Partners explains how investor—and executive—behavior would change if companies had to disclose metrics that revealed the true strength of their customer base, rather than the many accounting disclosures today that actually can mask damage done to customers and customer relationships in pursuit of short-term profits.

Dan McCarthy spends his time figuring out what loyalty is worth to shareholders, and how to measure it. As cofounder of Theta Equity Partners and assistant professor of marketing at Emory University’s Goizueta Business School, he and his colleague, Wharton professor Peter Fader, have developed a technique called customer-based corporate valuation that helps shareholders value a company by analyzing how its customers behave. Their approach signals a shift from a “growth at all costs” mindset toward sustainable growth based on the acquisition and retention of profitable customers.

How does a banking group operating in multiple countries accelerate improvements in customer experience, particularly digital improvements, while still meeting the unique needs of individual countries? This was the challenge facing UniCredit, and the topic of my podcast with Francesco Vercesi, UniCredit's head of Agile, practice sharing and customer service. The answer, as his title implies, was to create a centralized Agile process, but with product owners in each country empowered to set their development priorities.

Silos are deeply rooted in human nature. We should stop complaining about them and instead ask: How can we harness the tribal behavior that generates silos to create value for customers? To learn more, I turned to Gillian Tett of the Financial Times. Her book, The Silo Effect: The Peril of Expertise and the Promise of Breaking Down Barriers, explores the role of silos in the financial crisis and in our everyday lives. “Silos exist for the very simple reason that we’re human,” she says.  

In this podcast, Raj Sivasubramanian, customer experience insights manager at Airbnb, explains how Airbnb is experimenting with a system that makes it easy for customers to provide video feedback. I admit, I was skeptical. But Raj explains why that often provides longer, more detailed and often richly emotional feedback. More important, he says, when transmitted directly to frontline employees and leaders, that emotion often generates the sort of empathy that inspires and motivates thoughtful action.

Kim Scott's book, Radical Candor, focuses on the role that feedback plays in helping other people succeed and the idea that delivering tough messages to colleagues is important when done right. But, Kim discovered, "an awful lot of people are using Radical Candor as an excuse to act like a garden variety jerk.” In this episode, we talk about the revised edition of her book, which addresses some misconceptions about her ideas. We also listen to one of the funniest examples of radical candor gone wrong, from the HBO series Silicon Valley.  

Luis Angel-Lalanne, vice president of customer listening for American Express, explains how his team goes beyond the mechanics of simply providing Net Promoter scores and the drivers behind them. At American Express, that can mean combining Net Promoter data with other operational data and performing an analysis to uncover previously unrealized links that affect customer experience .

Sandy Rogers's efforts to measure customer experience at Enterprise Rent-A-Car were part of the inspiration for the design of the Net Promoter system. Today, Sandy is the global practice leader for loyalty at Franklin Covey and coauthor of Leading Loyalty, but in this podcast, he also describes how he managed to convince the leaders of Enterprise, a large, successful company, to take chances that would wind up changing their fundamental approach to customer service. It started with figuring out how to measure customer experience. Sandy is someone I’ve been learning from for many years, and as usual, speaking with him was both inspiring and educational. I hope you enjoy the conversation as much as I did.  

One of the most important, and difficult, roles of any leadership team is to instill in the workforce a culture and sense of purpose. Back in 2014, I did a podcast interview that put this challenge in simple, stark terms that have stayed fresh in my memory. That’s largely thanks to my guest at the time, the inimitable Horst Schulze, co-founder of the Ritz-Carlton hotel group and founder of the Capella Hotel groups. He’s an exceptionally plain-talking common-sense leader who just doesn’t take excuses for poor service. And he believes, passionately, that good service depends not on management, but on inspired employees. 

Horst Schulze is famous for being the visionary co-founder of the Ritz-Carlton and Capella hotel groups. They are two brands that set the bar for luxury service, and yet, Horst will tell you, his vision of luxury depends on employees how share that vision and feel a true sense of purpose to deliver it every day.

Former GE executive Beth Comstock has a long and successful track record of finding stories within a company and using them to create strategies, build entrepreneurial teams and take imaginative risks. The author of the recent book Imagine It Forward: Courage, Creativity, and the Power of Change, Beth spent nearly three decades at GE. As vice chair of business innovation and, before that, chief marketing officer, she led efforts to accelerate new growth, develop digital and clean-energy initiatives, seed new businesses and build brand value. She was also part of GE’s pioneering efforts to adopt Net Promoter® and learn how to use it as both a metric and as a vehicle for telling customer stories.

For Francesco Lagutaine, Manulife Asia's chief marketing and experience design officer, Asia is a market of contradictions. On  the one hand, insurance products are relatively new to the region, so simply delivering well and reliably on business basics will still wow customers. On the other hand, customers have enormously high expectations for fast and simple digital services, because they compare them with platforms such as WeChat in China or Go-Jek in Indonesia. In this episode, he talks about how Manulife Asia has begun creating specialized teams to improve customer experiences.

Most of us think about Uber as a true digital disrupter. Yet, there is a very large human side to Uber. When a driver, a rider or “an eater” (someone ordering food through Uber Eats) needs help resolving something that can’t be addressed purely in-app, they contact Community Operations, an organization of some 30,000 people run by Troy Stevenson. In this episode, Troy describes how he helped Uber navigate its rapid growing pains. He also has something many customer-focused executives would envy: vast amounts of real-time customer data, most of it in modern, accessible databases. In this podcast, he shares some of the ways that he makes sure that data gets turned into action, and talks about why that’s both a science and an art.

When veteran leader Amy Cribbs took on the challenge of improving customer experience at Vanguard, the world’s largest mutual fund company, she felt ready for the challenges of adopting new, Agile ways of working. But her experience proved to be full of surprises. A expected, the new cross-functional teams helped Vanguard design better customer experiences and deliver them faster. But there was a lot more. In a previous episode, Amy described how the Agile approach had revealed unexpected insights about what really mattered to customers, which helped the teams design even better customer episodes. As it turns out, the new insights extended well beyond customer needs. The biggest and most rewarding surprise, says Amy, came when she saw individual employees blossom. The unexpected customer insights the Agile approach delivered also reinforced the need for humility when it comes to thinking she understands what customers want. Similarly, she says, she has learned the importance of being a servant leader so she can nurture, not control the new ways of thinking that Agile encouraged on her teams. 

When Vanguard, the customer loyalty leader in its industry, decided it needed to do more to keep pace with rapidly changing client expectations, that meant more than just investing money in client experience or in digital or mobile technologies. It meant shifting to new ways of working that would give Vanguard the flexibility and speed necessary to respond continuously to changes in customer needs. In this episode, Amy Cribbs, who leads Customer Experience for the mutual fund giant, explains how Vanguard began using an Agile, cross-functional approach that made client experience everyone’s ongoing responsibility. 

Andrew Clayton, global head of customer experience at E.ON, talks to Rob about how you inspire an organization to respond to customer feedback, not once or twice, but continuously, with unflagging energy. Since the early 2000s, he has scaled sustainable NPS programs at three major companies, Allianz, Bupa, and now E.ON. He has become an expert at winding that customer feedback loop into the DNA of the company, so that NPS self-replicates, even into new teams and new projects.

Alex Terpstra, head of innovations at ABN AMRO Bank, was born and raised for customer service. His father, a retailer in the Netherlands, never failed to remind young Alex who put food on the family’s table. “Every day on our dinner table we were talking about customers.” On this episode of the Net Promoter System podcast, Alex explains how he helped ABN AMRO to launch radically new services for its customers, even at the risk of a short-term profit hit. The payoff, he says, has been highly lucrative customer relationships that pay dividends far beyond the initial costs.

A recent Wall Street Journal article ran under a catchy headline, “The Dubious Management Fad Sweeping Corporate America.” The dubious management fad, according to the article, is the Net Promoter Score. Of course, the headline bothered me and my podcast guest, Maurice FitzGerald, the former vice president of customer experience at HP. But once we read past the attention-grabbing headline, we agreed with much of what the authors had to say. They provided a sober summary of many ways a company can misinterpret or misuse the Net Promoter Score. In fact, I’d encourage NPS practitioners to ignore the headline and read the article with an eye towards all of the things you shouldn’t do with the score. While NPS has gained tremendous popularity, many companies have cut corners or failed to invest in understanding the benefits of a comprehensive Net Promoter System. The article offers a jumping off point for a deeper conversation about the mistakes and errors that we wish all practitioners of the Net Promoter System would avoid, once and for all.

IBM used to collect customer feedback through longitudinal surveys—until Kathy McGettrick, the vice president of market development and insights at IBM, realized the surveys put all responsibility for creating quality experiences on IBM's sellers and ignored other aspects of the customer experience. So Kathy launched a digital platform that sent client feedback deeper into IBM. Today, some 40,000 IBMers use a client experience management platform that tracks hundreds of thousands of data points.

Razia Richter’s path to the executive suite at Petco took her on a wild, winding tour of the company’s operations and back-office functions, from accounting to inventory analytics to supply chain, to name a few. By the time Razia was put in charge of Petco’s customer experience and the adoption of the Net Promoter System, she had personally busted through just about every organizational silo imaginable. And because she had walked in the shoes of so many of the company’s line leaders, her early days as chief customer officer were marked by surprisingly little of the resistance often encountered when companies adopt the Net Promoter System. Her practical experience guided her to pursue an approach that earned the trust of business leaders and functional teams. Without that trust, many companies fail to achieve the culture change that the Net Promoter System demands. In this podcast, Razia shares just how far you can go when you have executive buy-in from the start.

Loyal listeners may recall my last conversation, with Joshua Rossman, formerly the senior director of global customer loyalty and NPS at eBay. Since that interview, Josh has left eBay and consulted with a variety of companies on using the Net Promoter System to help guide customer experience improvements. Now he's at McAfee, one of the world's largest security technology companies.  Josh has mastered the art of creating a customer feedback system that supports senior executive goal setting and decision making, while also providing the platform for frontline learning and growth. His approach gets to the very heart of why a customer becomes a promoter or a detractor in the first place. By developing a rich set of qualitative insights and combining it with the quantitative data surrounding NPS, Josh seizes the attention of executives across the organization and draws leaders into a fast-moving feedback loop with the customers.  

Kevin Parker is the chairman and CEO of HireVue, a platform for automating job interviews. Hirevue combines video interviews of job applicants with an AI-powered algorithms that can filter for qualifications faster than any HR team. Of course, an algorithm doesn’t evaluate candidates the same way a human could. Like any breakthrough in machine learning, it’s a grab bag of promising signals, emerging from the noise, and, well, noise. As Kevin will tell you, though, the signal-to-noise ratio is falling fast. 

Host Rob Markey and Ignacio 'Nacho' Deschamps, group head of international banking and digital transformation at Scotiabank, discuss the role of the Net Promoter System in culture change. They also explore what Nacho has learned during Net Promoter System journeys at three different banks around the world, including how to survive the wait for results to catch up to investment during year two.

Host Rob Markey talks to Ignacio 'Nacho' Deschamps, Group Head of International Banking and Digital Transformation at Scotiabank, who explains why he has long put customers and technology at the heart of his career in banking and describes how many of Scotiabank’s digital efforts are developed locally and then shared internationally throughout the bank.

This week, on the Net Promoter System Podcast, I’m sharing Part 2 of my interview with Gen. Stanley McChrystal, the former commander of U.S forces in Afghanistan and head of the Joint Special Operations Command during the Iraq war.   We pick up the conversation where we left off: how a leader, who has successfully built trust among a team of rivals, can then push the organization to change its strategy on a dime.

General Stanley McChrystal, the former commander of U.S forces in Afghanistan and head of the Joint Special Operations Command in Iraq, joins me for part one of a two-part interview. In our discussion, he describes how he forged trust among the military’s most elite fighting units. Today, he shares what he learned with civilian executives, as a co-founder of the McChrystal Group, offering battle-tested advice to leaders in the business world.

When I rent a car, I too often find myself waiting in line for the service desk, wondering why my car wasn’t ready and waiting for me, as promised.  Now I can test my hypotheses against the real world experience of this week’s guest, Eric Smuda. He led customer experience practices for two different giants of the rental car industry, Avis Budget Group and Hertz. He draws back the black curtain, and reveals what it’s like to deliver a car to a customer, from behind the scenes.

Like fitness or dieting, getting started with the Net Promoter System is easy in some ways. Executives are typically optimistic and excited about their fledgling program, riding the high of their early wins. And then something emerges and threatens that momentum. But like maintaining good health, the companies that stay the course learn to anticipate their customers’ needs, allowing them to deepen relationships and deliver bigger financial results in the long term. That’s what happened at CA Technologies. In this episode, I continue my conversation with Dayton Semerjian. He guided the enterprise software company through a Net Promoter journey that returned it to growth. In this episode, Dayton discusses the challenges he faced while bringing culture change to CA and how he overcame them.

CA Technologies’ Dayton Semerjian joined me on the podcast in 2016 to discuss his approach to managing the enterprise software company’s customer experience in a rapidly changing industry. At the time, the business-to-business service provider was deep in a Net Promoter journey that would ultimately rebuild its customer relationships and return it to growth. Fast forward two years and Dayton’s efforts as general manager of global customer success and support not only surpassed senior leaders’ expectations, they made CA an attractive acquisition target. In light of CA’s success, I invited Dayton back on the podcast to reflect on his experience in the first of a two-part interview.

Host Rob Markey talks to Brian Scudamore, the founder and CEO of 1-800-GOT-JUNK, whose rubbish hauling business started as a way to pay for college and grew into an international franchise. Brian discusses how the company’s commitment to customer service helped set it apart from competitors and what it takes to maintain service standards in a growing business.

Big things have been happening at Citizens Financial Group, the New England-based financial services company. After spending 26 years as part of the Royal Bank of Scotland, the company returned to the public market in a 2014 initial offering that raised $3 billion. And the bank has been undergoing a multiyear turnaround effort that has put customers at the center of its business. In this episode, Rob Markey talks to Beth Johnson, chief marketing officer and head of virtual channels for Citizens Bank. She has been a key player in these efforts since she joined the company in 2013.

Host Rob Markey talks to Bain Partner Gerard du Toit. His team recently asked hundreds of executives if they've adopted 20 of the most popular customer experience tools, and more importantly, whether they're happy with the results. While customer experience tools are not a panacea, they do form an arsenal with which companies can arm themselves to compete. Gerard also discusses the results and other emerging trends in customer experience.

Medical outcomes matter, but they're not the only factor in patient satisfaction. A provider's ability to communicate and express empathy are also critical to the customer experience in healthcare.  Host Rob Markey welcomes back Maurice FitzGerald, retired vice president of customer experience at HP Software and author of Net Promoter—Implement the System. Rob and Maurice discuss the unique customer experience challenges that healthcare providers and organizations face, and how the Net Promoter System can help.

Host Rob Markey welcomes back Jeanne Bliss, author of the new customer experience book, Would You Do that to Your Mother? In her book, she argues that companies need to humanize the customer experience to help their employees provide the service that customers want.  Jeanne also advises senior leaders as founder and president of CustomerBliss, and previously oversaw the customer experience at Land’s End, Microsoft, Coldwell Banker and Allstate.

Follow-up calls offer an opportunity to hear real customers describe, in detail, the things that make them love your company, or not. And they can involve senior executives in learning what it’s like to be an average customer or an average frontline employee—to get out of the mindset of “corporate” and into the world where customers interact with your company every day. In this episode, Rob Markey continues his conversation with Charlie Herrin, Comcast’s chief customer experience officer, who has been leading Comcast’s multiyear Net Promoter turnaround. He discusses some of the most important drivers of culture change there. 

Cable company executives know they have shaky relationships with many customers. In fact, most have been working to improve their customer experience. And one or two are taking truly radical steps to improve. Comcast, one of the biggest Internet providers in the US, is among those working hardest to earn more trust and loyalty from customers. In this episode, Rob Markey talks to Charlie Herrin, Comcast’s chief customer experience officer. 

USAA, which primarily serves members of the US military and their families, has some of the most loyal customers in business. How does the company do it? USAA has organized itself around customer episodes—all the steps required to meet a customer’s need—instead of products and services. The company has gone beyond identifying and tracking these crucial moments to assigning leaders to manage and enhance them, using Agile methods to speed change. Rob Markey recently spoke with Julio Estevez-Breton, USAA's vice president of member and market insights, about the benefits the company is seeing from this radical approach and what it took to get there. 

Rob Markey talks to Charlie Chase, president and CEO of FirstService Brands, which provides property services such as painting, remodeling and storage design through its franchise network. Charlie started as a painting franchise owner in 1982 and went on to start CertaPro Painters, one of the company’s brands.  FirstService uses the Net Promoter System to collect feedback from not only customers, but also prospects who didn't choose his company's services. This allows FirstService's leaders to identify and address weak service experiences.  

Rob Markey welcomes back Fernando Cadena, director of associate engagement at Elwood Staffing Services, which places 25,000 temporary employees at companies across the country. Fernando has been leading the firm’s Net Promoter efforts, which began six years ago when he first sought feedback from the company’s associates. He has since expanded the company's feedback efforts to its customers. Net Promoter feedback has helped Elwood Staffing improve its customer experience, increase employee retention and build better relationships with the companies it serves. 

Year Up has helped thousands of young adults leave minimum wage jobs and forge meaningful careers. Its one-year program has served almost 20,000 people since 2000, and the vast majority end up in roles at major companies or in college.   Delivering such strong results requires Year Up to balance the needs of its students, donors and the companies that provide critical support and internships. The organization has been using the Net Promoter System to gauge those relationships to ensure that everyone's needs are met.  Garrett Warfield, senior director of research and evaluation, and Research and Evaluation Manager Jess Britt say that feedback is simply part of Year Up's culture. In this episode, Rob Markey talks to Garrett and Jess about Net Promoter's role in achieving the organization's mission.      

What do successful leaders have in common? It often comes down to two key traits: passion and perseverance. In other words, they have grit.  In this episode, Angela Duckworth, a psychology professor at the University of Pennsylvania, shares insights from her New York Times best-selling book, Grit: The Power of Passion and Perseverance. She's also the founder of Character Lab, a nonprofit that works to advance the science of character development.

When companies set out to dramatically improve their customer experience, they have many decisions to make—where to invest, which markets to go after, which touchpoints to enhance. And there are usually many opinions to consider for each choice.  In this episode, Rob Markey talks to Bain Partner Jason Barro about how companies can use a roadmap to leadership to set priorities and find clarity as they work toward customer centricity.   

Rob Markey talks to Jackson Jeyanayagam, chief marketing officer at Boxed, an online grocery startup that's taking on traditional wholesalers by offering personalized service and convenient delivery. Jackson joined the company in 2016 after overseeing digital marketing at Chipotle Mexican Grill.      

Host Rob Markey talks to Celine Del Genes, vice president, concept to consumer, for Adidas Football. She oversees the sports apparel company’s go-to-market strategy for soccer shoes and gear, managing key decisions about pricing, sales channels and marketing approaches. Celine is also a Net Promoter practitioner and uses the method to gauge customer reaction to company initiatives and product design. She recently brought together social marketing, agile decision-making and Net Promoter feedback in an innovative campaign to promote Adidas' Glitch soccer cleat. 

Rob Markey talks to Bain Partner Jeff Melton, co-leader of Bain Simple & Digital, an approach that helps companies apply digital technology where it matters. Jeff discusses the importance of choosing the right metrics to gauge a customer episode and what happens when companies choose the wrong ones.

Dell has been collecting customer feedback since Michael Dell dropped out of college three decades ago and founded the company. It's part of the company's DNA. The computer maker began its Net Promoter journey a decade ago when it was trying to connect customer satisfaction with economic outcomes. Now the company has a robust Net Promoter System that informs major projects and innovations. In this episode, host Rob Markey catches up with Marc Stein, senior vice president of customer experience at Dell. Marc discusses how the company’s comprehensive Net Promoter System has evolved since Dell merged with EMC in 2016.

Rob Markey welcomes Griff and Hunter Jaggard, the brothers behind the FireDisc, a portable propane cooking surface that has become required gear among outdoor enthusiasts. They launched their company in 2010 with a tractor plow disc and an idea inspired by their Texas childhoods, and they have been using Net Promoter to help guide their efforts.

When responding to an angry customer, few words are as effective as "I'm sorry." And yet, it's so hard for some people to apologize sincerely. Why? In this episode, host Rob Markey welcomes back Maurice FitzGerald, retired vice president of customer experience at HP Software and author of Net Promoter—Implement the System. Together, Rob and Maurice will discuss how behavioral economics can inform companies' interactions with customers and how they use the Net Promoter System.

How does a customer's country of origin affect the feedback they provide about service experiences? Are certain countries home to naturally tough critics? Do people in some countries view rating scales differently? Cultural differences play a role in Net Promoter feedback, but to a far lesser degree than many practitioners assume. The challenge is to separate cultural issues from real service problems. In this episode, host Rob Markey welcomes back Maurice FitzGerald, retired vice president of customer experience at HP Software and author of Net Promoter—Implement the System. Together, Rob and Maurice will take on questions about cultural differences that Net Promoter System practitioners often encounter.  

Despite companies’ best efforts to engage their teams, more than half of employees say they are uninspired and dissatisfied in their roles, according to Bain research. Only 19% of employees say they’re inspired and satisfied—a huge opportunity for companies that learn to tap their teams’ potential. We’ve spent the last several years studying companies’ best engagement methods and distilling them into a simple approach that other companies could adopt to get their employees’ best. We call it Net Promoter for People. In this episode, host Rob Markey welcomes Darci Darnell, who leads Bain’s Customer Strategy and Marketing practice in the Americas and has played a critical role in developing this powerful system.

Building internal support for a fledgling Net Promoter System can be one of the biggest challenges of getting such an effort off the ground. It requires leaders to not only have a strong grasp of loyalty economics and the company's strategy, but the softer skills necessary to inspire and teach employees to do the right thing for customers. In this episode, host Rob Markey welcomes back Maurice FitzGerald, retired vice president of customer experience at HP Software and author of Net Promoter—Implement the System. Together, Rob and Maurice will discuss how companies can rally their employees around their Net Promoter System efforts.

No industry has escaped the disruption of digital technology. Advertising is no exception. Ad agencies, which previously thrived in what was once a loyalty-based industry, are now facing new competition as they struggle to hold on to client relationships. Advertising fee structures have also changed, along with customer expectations. In this episode, host Rob Markey talks to advertising industry expert Michael Farmer, author of Madison Avenue Manslaughter: An Inside View of Fee-Cutting Clients, Profit-Hungry Owners and Declining Ad Agencies. His firm, Farmer & Co., advises advertising agencies on business strategy, giving him a front-row seat to the industry's dramatic shifts. Michael shares his observations of the changing ad industry and lessons for other companies.

Begging customers for strong scores. Only seeking feedback from customers who had positive outcomes. Altering contact information to make dissatisfied customers hard to reach. When it comes to gaming the Net Promoter System, we've seen it all and one thing is always clear: When employees intentionally undermine a company's efforts to understand customers and improve service, everyone loses. In this episode, Rob Markey welcome back Maurice FitzGerald, retired vice president of customer experience at HP Software and author of Net Promoter—Implement the System. Together, they discuss ways that companies can discourage employees from sabotaging their feedback efforts.

Airbnb launched 10 years ago when roommates Brian Chesky and Joe Gebbia decided to rent out an air mattress on the floor of their San Francisco living room to make a few extra bucks. Now it's a $31 billion hospitality giant that has created a whole new category of lodging. Airbnb's unique business model, which allows people in more than 190 countries to rent their homes to travelers, requires a high level of trust among not only guests and hosts, but also employees and managers. The company has gone to great lengths to infuse that sense of trust, inside and out. In this episode, host Rob Markey welcomes Aisling Hassell, global head of customer experience at Airbnb. Aisling joined Airbnb more than three years ago after leading customer experience efforts at Sage, Vodafone and Symantec. She has played a critical role in promoting Airbnb's culture among hosts in the more than 65,000 cities where it operates.

The statistical validity of the Net Promoter Score depends on response rates; the higher the rate, the greater the accuracy. Low response rates can easily undermine a company's Net Promoter System, causing leaders to overlook burgeoning problems or wrongly assume that customers are happy. In this episode, host Rob Markey and Maurice FitzGerald, retired vice president of customer experience at HP Software and author of Net Promoter—Implement the System, tackle common questions about response rates.  Learn more: Creating a Reliable Metric

People feel good when they look good—it doesn't take a fashion expert to tell you that. But that feeling compounds when you make it easy for people to access clothing that's unique, fits well and suits the occasion. That's the Rent the Runway approach. The company launched in 2009 with a mission to help women feel their best by renting them designer clothing and accessories through an innovative subscription model. The service has been a huge hit, allowing the company to earn more than 6 million members and more than $190 million in venture capital. In this episode, Rent the Runway's CEO and Cofounder Jennifer Hyman discusses the company's disruptive business model and how it built a loyal following in one of the most fickle industries out there.

What does it take to develop meaningful competitive benchmark Net Promoter Scores? What is the relationship between benchmark trends and revenue? What if your company is small or operates in a niche industry with few competitors for comparison? Competitive benchmark Net Promoter Scores provide an objective and fair basis for comparing your company’s feedback to the feedback your competitors earn. Done right, they can provide the basis for goal setting and prioritization at the highest levels of a company. However, calculating a sound benchmark score can be challenging and complex. In this episode, Rob Markey welcomes back Maurice FitzGerald, retired vice president of customer experience at HP Software and author of Net Promoter—Implement the System. Together, Rob and Maurice will tackle questions about competitive benchmarking from members of the Net Promoter System Forum on LinkedIn. Learn more: The Benefits of a Competitive Benchmark Net Promoter Score

What do customers really want when they buy a product? Some benefits are fairly obvious—convenience and quality, for example. But some customers, even those in business-to-business (B2B) markets, are seeking far more from their purchases—hope, self-actualization and motivation. Bain Partner Eric Almquist returns to the Net Promoter System Podcast to discuss developments in his Elements of Value framework and how companies are using it. Eric introduced his framework, which draws on themes from psychologist Abraham Maslow’s “hierarchy of needs,” last year in Harvard Business Review. In recent months, he has been expanding the framework to consider the specialized needs of companies in B2B markets.

When faced with a scrappy challenger, it's not hard for established brands to lose sight of their core customers, especially if they're in a highly competitive market. These situations usually arise when an established brand starts to lose market share to a buzzworthy upstart. When that happens, a company's leaders might debate whether they should change course to chase a new competitor or try to reconnect with the brand's base. Sarah Robb O’Hagan, CEO of the indoor cycling company Flywheel Sports, knows this scenario well. More than five years ago, she helped turn around PepsiCo's multibillion-dollar Gatorade brand when she was president of the sports drink's division. She went on to serve as president of the high-end gym operator Equinox before taking the helm at Flywheel Sports. Sarah, who's also the author of Extreme You: Step Up, Stand Out, Kick Ass. Repeat, shares her experiences in this episode, including her views on what it takes to connect with customers. 

What if a company wants to adopt the Net Promoter System, but lacks the resources and time to fully implement each aspect of the framework? Is something better than nothing? In this episode, Rob Markey welcomes back Maurice FitzGerald, the retired vice president of customer experience at HP Software and author of Net Promoter—Implementing the System. Together, Rob and Maurice will tackle this question and others submitted by members of the Net Promoter System Forum on LinkedIn, a group for Net Promoter practitioners that Maurice manages. The Net Promoter System continues to evolve and improve based on the experience of thousands of companies. Maurice and Rob reverse their roles in this episode, allowing Rob to share the latest thinking on critical Net Promoter issues, such as best practices for questions and tactics for collecting deeper feedback from business-to-business companies.  

Telecom executives are under pressure from their customers, shareholders and other stakeholders to become more digital, to exploit the new technologies and opportunities that will enable them to deliver more services and operate more efficiently. Some companies approach their digital transformation as a series of boxes to be ticked: mobile apps, better web services, more online transactions. But these companies are missing out on an opportunity to reinvent themselves. The most forward-looking executives will take advantage of this pressure not merely to digitalize their companies, but to deliver remarkably better experiences for customers.  In this episode, host Rob Markey talks to Bain Partner Frederic Debruyne. As head of Bain’s Telecommunications practice in Europe, the Middle East and Africa, Fred has been helping companies tap digital technology to radically simplify their customer experience, using Bain’s Simple & Digital approach.

In the old days, shop owners were on a first-name basis with their customers. Of course, the owners cultivated these relationships within their communities for years, allowing for the intimacy that so many companies aspire to today. It's tough to achieve—top leaders often drift further away from the front lines as a company grows. But technology is changing all that. Now companies are harnessing their customer data to form much deeper relationships at huge scale. In this short episode, we look at these new opportunities in relationship building and how firms of the future will need to adapt to take advantage of them.

If you're an angry customer, the last thing you want is another generic offer from the company that has raised your ire. These missteps can irreparably damage a relationship. But companies that know how to collect, analyze and act on customer data will learn to avoid these situations, says my colleague Tom Springer, who leads Bain's Advanced Analytics practice. They'll use that data to calibrate their offers based on a customer's level of advocacy, allowing them to expand relationships with promoters and avoid missteps that might leave detractors feeling exploited. Most companies have vast amounts of customer data—such as the recency, frequency and value of purchases, as well as the number of service calls—but few are using it to its deepen those relationships. Tom is helping companies harness Big Data in ways we couldn't imagine 10 years ago, creating new opportunities to build loyalty.

Employees who are sincerely happy almost always provide a better customer experience. But what can companies do to make a meaningful difference in how employees feel about their work? Shawn Achor, The New York Times best-selling author of The Happiness Advantage and Before Happiness, says that companies can do a lot. In fact, sometimes the solutions are as simple as encouraging social interaction and praise. In this episode, Shawn discusses the connection between happiness and success, and his work with Fortune 100 companies that want to increase employee engagement. 

Long before social media and online surveys, shopkeepers relied on a simple measure of customer sentiment: whether their customers were smiling.  In this short episode, Fred Reichheld and Rob Markey share the story behind the Net Promoter System's signature smiley face icons, and discuss how one number can become a powerful learning tool for inspiring lasting change. 

Do you shop online differently if the purchase involves clicking buttons vs. dragging an item into cart? Does a product search feel more fulfilling if it forces you to scroll through a vast trove of options? Do your survey responses change if the scale starts on the left or the right?  These are the questions that Jonathan Levav, associate professor of marketing at the Stanford Graduate School of Business, explores. His research looks at the factors that influence consumers’ choices and judgment, such as biomechanics, context cues and product attributes.  In this episode, Jonathan discusses his latest research projects and how businesses are increasingly turning to experimental psychology and behavioral economics for answers.       

One of the great philosophers said that a person who sets out to be happy probably won't achieve his goal. On the other hand, if a person sets out to help others and make the world a better place, he will probably end up happy. The same logic applies to companies that set the vague goal of maximizing shareholder value, according to Roger Martin, former dean of the Rotman School of Management at the University of Toronto. In reality, successful companies create products their customers want and provide exceptional service—and increase shareholder value in the process. Roger, who's the author of 10 books, including Getting Beyond Better and Playing to Win, and a frequent contributor to Harvard Business Review, shares his business philosophies in this episode.

By focusing on a single question, the Net Promoter System eliminates unnecessary complexity. Rob Markey and Fred Reichheld, inventor of the Net Promoter Score, explain the origins of the "likelihood to recommend" question. 

Steve Jobs. Charles Schwab. Howard Schultz. They all spotted an unmet customer need and made it their mission to meet it. They also founded iconic companies that started out as disruptors only to struggle as bureaucracy and distraction set in. In each case, it took the founder’s return to get the company back on track.  It’s a story that will be played out again and again in business. But it doesn’t have to. According to Bain Partner Chris Zook, these companies have battled the predictable crises of growth. In The Founder’s Mentality, a new book Chris cowrote with Bain's James Allen, Chris talks about how companies can hold on to the spirit of their founders as they grow. No surprise: It requires companies to focus on their customers. He recently joined me on the podcast.  

Rob Markey discusses how he became a Net Promoter convert with Fred Reichheld, inventor of the Net Promoter Score.

Millennium Mat has developed a unique culture in which employees make production decisions for their teams and share in the financial benefits of their success. The leaders of these teams are called CEOs and they make all of the hiring and production decisions. Their employees, whom Millennium calls partners, are expected to bring forth their performance-improving ideas. Companies of all sizes and in all industries could learn a lot from Millennium’s approach, which has propelled its business to almost 40 countries. In this episode, Millennium Mat’s founder Ian Malpass discusses what it takes to forge a culture that’s truly self-directing and self-correcting.  

Large companies live and die by traditional financial forecasts—earnings estimates, sales targets and so forth. After all, it’s how the market measures their value and whether they’re worthy of investment.   The intense pressures to meet these goals can cause some executives to make short-term cuts that can undermine their long-term strategies. Some would argue that we need new gauges of corporate strength. The Net Promoter Score is a very powerful measure, but so is another: customer lifetime value. This measure helps companies identify their most valuable customers and build those relationships.  Peter Fader, a marketing professor at the Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania, returns to the Net Promoter System Podcast to discuss the importance of measuring customer lifetime value. He recently founded a company called Zodiac that specializes in estimating customer value.  

The Net Promoter System's "outer loop" is used to prioritize and address problems that can't be resolved by individuals or small teams. Rob Markey discusses why a robust, rigorous and transparent "outer loop" is essential to a solid Net Promoter System in this short episode.  Read more: The Net Promoter System's Outer Loop

A lot of companies find themselves a situation in which their competitors are increasingly adding value to their products, while they’re struggling to figure out which features and services might move the needle with customers. The leaders of these companies aren’t sure what level of service will capture more of their market—or if they should even focus on service. It's the classic “how to play/where to win” question. Companies can't invest in everything. To succeed, they must distinguish themselves from competitors. Often this means meeting customers' deepest needs—aspirations they might not even be aware of. Bain Partner Eric Almquist has spent much of his career researching these questions. In this episode, he discusses the 30 elements of value that draw customers most to a product or service. Companies that fulfill more of these needs have customers who are more loyal. 

Does the Net Promoter Score gauge a customer's broader relationship with a company or just the customer's most recent experience? Or both? Who should make follow-up calls to customers? Rob Markey addresses these questions and more in this episode.

Why does the Net Promoter scale go from zero to 10? Why is passive not the same as neutral? Rob Markey answers these questions and others in this episode.   Recommended reading:  The Benefits of a Competitive Benchmark Net Promoter Score Creating a Reliable Metric

The goal of the Net Promoter System is to create a culture that encourages employees to bring energy and creativity to their jobs.  Developing that kind of culture requires inspiring leaders. We’ve all seen those people who seem born to be leaders. They have an uncanny knack for motivating the people around them. They show gratitude and connect with people in authentic ways. You might chalk it up to charisma or a rare innate gift. While that might be true, it’s possible that they studied their own behavior and learned how to mobilize the best qualities of their personality. In this episode, Rob Markey talks to Bain Partner Mark Horwitch, who has been studying what makes a leader inspiring. He says it comes down to 33 qualities. Most of us have some of them, but none of us have all of them. He says that when we know our strengths, we can develop them into true leadership assets. Learn more: How Leaders Inspire: Cracking the Code

The team huddle is the part of the Net Promoter System that connects the inner loop to the outer loop. Rob Markey discusses why regular get-togethers—often daily or weekly—are a critical element of the system. Read more: The Net Promoter System's "Huddle": How Employees Come Together to Focus on Customers and Teamwork

It’s a question just about every manager wrestles with: How do I get my employees to do what I want them to do? How do I get them to be more empathetic to customers? To take feedback and make meaningful changes? Obviously, fair pay is essential, but there’s far more to it. After all, motivating people requires tapping into deep emotional needs for autonomy, purpose and affiliation. In this episode, Rob Markey talks to Daniel Pink, author of the 2011 best-seller Drive: The Surprising Truth About What Motivates Us. In the book, Daniel breaks down the scientific research on motivation and explains why simple carrot-and-stick approaches rarely result in the behaviors that companies want.  Recommended reading: Your Best Employees Work for Love, Not Money

The Net Promoter Score is a simple measure, but building a process and culture that results in deep customer relationships can be very complex. In this episode, Rob Markey answers listeners' questions on everything from competitive benchmarks to best practices for following up with customers.  Do you have a question for Rob? Feel free to tweet your question to @rgmarkey on Twitter or write it in the comments field on any post on the Net Promoter System blog. 

The Net Promoter System has a mechanism called the inner loop that helps employees of all kinds get real-time feedback directly from customers. The feedback is usually positive—most employees do their job pretty well—so people typically become more engaged and enthusiastic. The occasional criticism or complaint about a specific interaction or decision can help individual employees and the organization learn to do their jobs better. The challenge is to set up the inner loop in the right way, so that it reinforces learning rather than undermining it.  In this short episode, Rob Markey discusses how the inner loop speeds learning.  Learn more: The Net Promoter System's "Inner Loop": The Secret to Individual Learning and Connections with Customers

The best companies--loyalty leaders that grow profitably--do things to teach their employees to do their jobs better. In fact, the Net Promoter System was designed to help companies facilitate and accelerate that individual learning. The system's inner loop and huddle play important roles in encouraging feedback and coaching so that employees can serve customers better and contribute to the mission of the organization. Some people think that developing deep expertise simply requires time and practice, but there's more to it. Anders Ericsson, coauthor of the new book Peak: Secrets from the New Science of Expertise, and his team have deconstructed what it takes to become a true expert in a variety of fields. What they've discovered has direct application to any company.

What qualities and experiences make for a successful chief advocacy officer? Not just anyone will do, regardless of how bright and ambitious he or she may seem to be. The best CAOs aren’t always the people you might think of first, and they aren’t always working in predictable roles. But one thing is for sure: It's important to choose someone who has the respect of the organization's leaders. In this short episode, Rob Markey discusses some critical considerations for companies that are choosing a CAO. Learn more: Who Should Run Your Net promoter System?

Ride-hailing companies disrupted the traditional taxi and limo industry by offering unprecedented convenience. But less has been said about the customer experience at these fast-growing companies, which typically allow customers and drivers to rate their interactions. After all, these companies rely on thousands of independent drivers in markets across the country. I recently had the pleasure of speaking with Mary Winfield, vice president of customer experience and trust at Lyft. She says that her company strives to create a culture of respect with drivers that empowers them to make authentic connections with passengers. The company does that by offering services that help drivers get paid quickly and resolve problems faster. Mary also makes time in her schedule to interact with customers and drivers. She shares more of Lyft's service philosophies in this episode. 

In this short episode of the Net Promoter System Podcast, Rob Markey explains how a customer advocacy office, or CAO, can be a focal point for learning about—and improving—the customer experience. A customer advocacy office can serve as the project management office that coordinates product development, marketing and other functional groups in the organization to focus on the customer experience. Net Promoter provides the methodology and the tools; the CAO is the arm of management that puts the methods and tools to work. Learn more: The Essential Role of the Customer Advocacy Office

Most companies that serve other companies solicit feedback, often in the form of quarterly or semiannual satisfaction surveys. The Net Promoter System in a B2B setting also solicits feedback from customers. But that’s where the similarity to conventional methodologies ends. This system’s twin goals are to foster customer engagement and build strong client relationships. It isn’t so much a survey method as a means of facilitating relationship-enhancing conversations. It helps sales reps and account managers get involved in solving customers’ problems. It shows marketers and product designers and service engineers ways to make the customer’s experience better. The feedback it provides is continuous: It offers granular insights into what is troubling or delighting any given customer at any given time. In this short episode of the Net Promoter System Podcast, Rob Markey discusses how the system can facilitate relationship-enhancing conversations. Learn more: Get Real Feedback from Your B2B Customers

How do you get the best out of employees? Scripted interactions and oppressive rules are never the answer. The best companies hire the right people and set the right expectations, and they trust their employees to use their judgment to make customers happy. When executives step back, employees provide more authentic and empathetic service.   Former Disney executive Lee Cockerell returns to the podcast to share his tips for striking that balance between loose and tight control. At Disney, Lee ran a operation with tens of thousands of employees who were spread across a huge physical space and ranged across a multitude of operational and service functions. What does it take to create a magical experience on that scale? Strong hires, high expectations and trust.   If you missed Lee's first interview, you can check it out here: At Disney, the Show Must Go On   

What do you call the space between you and your customer? According to Dayton Semerjian, that's where you'll find the true value of a customer relationship. Dayton is general manager of global customer success and support at the IT services firm CA Technologies.  CA's customers tend to be large companies, and the decision to buy its software and services is usually made by big groups of people armed with heavy analysis. Customer relationships can be very complex, involving many internal teams that handle sales, implementation and tech support. It’s not that uncommon for some customers to feel like they've fallen through the cracks in situations like these. In this episode, Dayton shares what it takes to earn promoters in complex client relationships. Learn more: Do Your B2B Customers Promote Your Business?  

Hotels didn’t always give out free toiletries. It wasn’t until the 1970s, when a Four Seasons hotel in London first started offering shampoo in showers that other hotels started following suit. And Four Seasons has been setting high standards for luxury travel—and hospitality in general—ever since. Barbara Talbott, former chief marketing officer at Four Seasons Hotels and Resorts, shares how the company grew from a small chain to a global luxury brand during her two decades with the company. She left to start GlenLarkin Advisors in 2009, and now shares her keen sense of customer experience with other companies.

Employees need to see the fundamental connection between the work they do every day and its impact on customers. They must experience firsthand the deep satisfaction of earning their customers’ heartfelt gratitude and loyalty. If they don’t, then their jobs are just jobs—they may do as they’re told, but they won’t bring much energy, enthusiasm or creativity to the workplace. In this Net Promoter System Podcast short, Rob Markey explains how companies can create an environment where employees bring their best to work every day on behalf of the company. Learn more: Energetic, Enthusiastic and Creative

To close the loop is not only to let customers know that you have heard their feedback but also to bring the customer’s voice right inside the organization. Employees get a direct line to the people they are serving. They see and hear how they are creating or destroying loyalty and what they can do to improve the customer experience.  In this short episode, Rob Markey explains why this step is a central element of the Net Promoter System. Learn more: Closing the Loop

Creating a pilot or prototype is an essential part of designing a robust Net Promoter System. These small-scale efforts allow a company to experiment with the system's essential elements, helping the company to create an effective program it can expand to other parts of the organization. In this Net Promoter System Podcast short, Rob Markey shares some best practices for prototypes. Learn more: The Value of Prototypes

  A number rarely tells the whole story. That's why leading Net Promoter companies ask customers to discuss their experiences in their own words.   Bain Fellow Fred Reichheld returns to the podcast to talk about the shortcomings of multiple-choice surveys, the power of verbatim feedback and some common customer service myths.  

Some people have a knack for forming genuine human connections whether it's with customers, colleagues or employees. They have a gift for making people feel special. The ability to speak with authenticity and authority might come natural to some people, but it's a skill that can be learned, says Jordan Harbinger, cofounder of The Art of Charm, a program that teaches people how to improve their social skills. Why should this matter to Net Promoter companies? These skills are critical to delighting customers and engaging employees as Jordan explains in this episode.

Recreating the same customer intimacy that an individual shopkeeper can provide is possible for large organizations if they have an operational infrastructure that can foster high-quality interactions on a bigger scale. Rob Markey explains how in this Net Promoter System Podcast short.

In the US, we're used to seeing sale signs that tout 40% discounts. However, consumers in China are more likely to see signs that promote the percentage a customer will have to pay after the price cut. This seemingly subtle shift speaks to the underlying motivations that inform a customer's buying decisions, says Angela Lee, a consumer psychologist and marketing professor at Northwestern University's Kellogg School of Management. In this episode, Angela discusses how culture and emotions influence brand loyalty and buying choices.

Have you ever found it hard to tell an employee that his work simply wasn't cutting it? Maybe you were afraid of hurting the employee's feelings or creating tension, so you decided not to say anything. Kim Scott, an executive coach and former Google executive, considers these situations missed opportunities for growth. She argues that honest criticism that's shared with sincere concern can empower employees at every level of a company. In this episode, Kim discusses her Radical Candor framework and the power of saying what you think.

It's a scenario that we routinely face: a company starts off using the Net Promoter System with great enthusiasm, gets a number of quick wins and then hits a wall. They inevitably ask themselves: "What are we doing wrong?" My colleague Aaron Cheris, one of the chief architects of Bain's Net Promoter System, gets this question a lot. So he helped craft an assessment tool that allows companies to measure their efforts in a straightforward and quantitative fashion. His premise was simple: find out what Net Promoter leaders are doing and work backward to understand why their results are so stellar. In this episode, Aaron discusses how companies use the assessment tool and what Net Promoter leaders do differently.

Maurice FitzGerald, the recently retired vice president of customer experience for the software business at Hewlett-Packard Enterprise, has been happily married for more than 25 years. But one Valentine’s Day, he had an epiphany about why some couples stay together for the long haul and others don’t—and why that knowledge is so critical to improving an organization’s customer experience. Maurice shares those insights and others from his Net Promoter experience at HP Enterprise in this episode.

Under Jack Brennan's leadership, Vanguard became an early adopter of the Net Promoter System. With it, customer loyalty became core to how the investment company operated. Jack pushed employees to ask "Are we doing the best thing for the client?" until the question became second nature to them. The goal was always to keep clients for life and to never take on a client they couldn't keep that long. In this episode of the Net Promoter System Podcast, Jack shares some of the practical lessons he learned from his experience at Vanguard.

VimpelCom is one of the largest telecom companies in the world, but a few years ago the company started facing more competition from a new crop of Internet-based rivals. The company decided to become more serious about its mission to focus on customers, adopting the Net Promoter System to guide its efforts. To gauge its progress, VimpelCom used Bain's Net Promoter System assessment tool to identify weak spots. In this episode, Rob Markey talks to VimpelCom executives Anton Telegin and Natalia Macpherson about what it took for the company to make this cultural shift.

The Net Promoter System is about creating a culture in which companies make better decisions on behalf of their customers. The only way to do that is to get reliable feedback from customers, says Rob Markey in this Net Promoter System Podcast short.

Customers can explain what's bothering them or what they like about a company. But they don't always know the full story behind their own feelings. Rob Markey discusses the importance of digging deeper into customer feedback in this Net Promoter System Podcast short.

Customer feedback has traditionally been used to evaluate performance, not necessarily improve it. The Net Promoter System, however, seeks to empower employees by teaching them the skills they need to generate loyalty and enthusiasm among customers. Rob Markey explains how in this Net Promoter System Podcast short.

Fifty years ago, few people could have guessed some of today's most common habits. Habits like having a mobile phone within arm's reach at all times; checking Facebook or email multiple times an hour, or calling an Uber instead of a cab. All companies dream of inspiring such new and compelling habits in their customers, but few manage to achieve it. Nir Eyal, author of Hooked: How to Build Habit-Forming Products, shares his theories on what sets these products apart.

The Net Promoter System is simple in concept, but adopting it can be a cataclysmic event for an organization. From asking frontline employees to reach out to customers to asking finance to manage new metrics, turning Net Promoter into tangible results typically requires significant culture change. Bain Partners Andreas Dullweber, Jason Barro and Maureen Burns discuss some of the biggest hurdles they encounter as they help companies build customer-centric cultures.

Earning goodwill among your customers isn't enough to ensure long-term growth. Leaders must also create the conditions that enable and encourage loyal customers to do what they’re inclined to do anyway. They have to offer customers a continuing stream of products or services that stand out from the competition. They have to deliver those goods at the right price, at the right time, through the right channels, using the right messages. And sometimes they have to help customers communicate their experiences to friends, relatives and the world at large, as Rob Markey explains in this Net Promoter System Podcast short.

Customer feedback is pointless if a company doesn't use it to improve the customer experience. To create loyalty, Net Promoter System companies use this input to address individual customers' concerns and inform systemic improvements, explains Rob Markey in this Net Promoter System Podcast short.

Greatness doesn't come just from getting the managerial levers right. It comes from inspiration, from people at every level feeling excited about doing the right thing by customers. That's the objective that underlies a CEO's commitment to focus on customers, to lead by example and to coach others in the organization. In this Net Promoter System Podcast short, Rob Markey discusses why putting loyalty at the heart of a business requires executives to view their jobs in a new light.

Unless you know how much more valuable your top customers are, you are flying blind. It's impossible to know how much to invest in efforts to create and retain more of these customers. In this Net Promoter System Podcast short, Rob Markey explains how companies use the Net Promoter System to understand the needs of their most valuable customers.

If you’re struggling to find pants that fit, the last place you probably turn is the Internet. But men's clothing retailer Bonobos is using customer service, feedback and design to challenge this assumption. On the latest episode, Bonobos Cofounder Andy Dunn shares his philosophy for creating memorable customer experiences both online and in stores.

Mobile phone stores increasingly depend on loyalty economics to drive their businesses. As a result, every customer interaction in one of these stores is vital. It’s a chance to wow a customer with a great experience, or to frustrate them with long waiting times, pushy salespeople or poorly trained technicians. Yet store owners generally struggle to get enough customer feedback to know how their customers’ purchasing experience feels to them, or what needs to be improved. Jimmy Salamanca, who runs six U.S. Cellular stores, discusses how he uses Fosubo, a feedback collection tool that uses text messaging, to gauge the customer experience. Fosubo CEO Misa Chien joins the discussion to explain how the tool works. Learn more about this episode

Why are so many of the global loyalty leaders run by their founders or their founders’ family members? What do they do that increases their ability to achieve and sustain customer loyalty? James Allen, head of Bain's Strategy practice, has studied successful founder-led companies in great detail. On the podcast, he discusses how companies can preserve what he calls the Founder’s Mentality while they grow into some of the largest firms in the world. Learn more about this episode

A few years ago, Qualtrics CEO Ryan Smith realized that there were 130,000 different versions of Net Promoter surveys in the survey company's system. The Net Promoter Score had become wildly popular among its customers, yet there was little consistency in its application. Ryan saw an opportunity to make it easier for Qualtrics customers to measure their Net Promoter Score. On the podcast, Ryan talks about Qualtrics' history, its Net Promoter tools and how it uses the Net Promoter System to keep the voice of the customer inside the company as it grows. Learn more about this episode

DonorsChoose founder Charles Best and CMO Katie Bisbee discuss how their nonprofit gives schoolchildren the supplies they need and donors the transparency they want. Learn more about this episode

In this Net Promoter System Podcast short, Rob Markey explains why it's important to create conditions that will help employees succeed before connecting Net Promoter Scores to compensation. Learn more: Your best employees work for love, not money Converting loyalty into economic advantage

In a previous episode of the Net Promoter System Podcast, we heard how Safelite applied the Net Promoter System and became a "people-powered" and "customer-driven" organization. It started with helping frontline workers change the game so they could build customer loyalty. In our latest discussion, CEO Tom Feeney and senior executives Natalie Crede and Renee Cacchillo explain why it's equally important to reset the priorities of leaders and their views of their own roles. Learn more: Leading a Net Promoter System company Energetic, enthusiastic and creative employees Learn more about this episode

Innovative restaurant companies such as Patxi's Pizza and Tomatina are putting a range of technologies to work to collect Net Promoter feedback from customers. One tool in particular, Thanx, offers restaurants a prepackaged rewards system and an easy way to gauge diner sentiment through a mobile app. Learn more: The economics of loyalty Closing the loop The infrastructure behind a Net Promoter System Learn more about this episode

Leading practitioners of the Net Promoter System seek feedback not only from their own customers but also from their competitors' customers. Competitive benchmark Net Promoter Scores provide an objective and fair basis for comparing your company's feedback to the feedback your competitors earn. Done right, they can provide the basis for goal setting and prioritization at the highest levels of a company. Learn more: The benefits of a competitive benchmark Net Promoter Score The Net Promoter System's "outer loop" Net Promoter System: Creating a reliable metric

The LEGO Group nearly went bankrupt a decade ago. It's hard to imagine. The company's return to profitability came from refocusing on its core: the bricks and the people who love to build with them. Conny Kalcher, vice president of marketing and consumer experiences at the LEGO Group, discusses how the company introduced the Net Promoter System and started collecting regular feedback to learn what Lego customers want. Conny says that Net Promoter gave the company a shared language that it could use to evaluate its products and that the system helped the company bring about broader culture change. Teams became more collaborative in working toward the ultimate goal of delighting customers.

E.ON's Olivier Mourrieras, Rene Matthies and Guntram Wurzberg discuss how market shifts prompted the energy provider to change its approach to service (3:45), its use of internal NPS (17:00) and loyalty economics (34:20).

In part two of our conversation with former Telstra CEO David Thodey, he discusses the benefits of regular team huddles (1:48), his approach to evaluating potential investments (10:40) and what he would do differently if he could (16:31).

In the first of a two-part interview, former Telstra CEO David Thodey discusses his decision to put customers first at the Australian telco (2:50), the difference between satisfaction and advocacy (10:50), and his approach to balancing investor expectations (25:50).

Darrell Rigby, head of Bain's Global Innovation practice, discusses what it takes to turn a great idea into an innovation (2:30), the "BothBrain" innovation concept (4:25) and the dangers of multitasking (35:00).

In honor of the podcast's 50th episode, Rob Markey highlights some of his favorite stories and lessons from podcast guests, including former Disney executive Lee Cockerell (2:05), hotelier Horst Schulze (9:53) and JetBlue's Bonny Simi (19:49).

Joshua Rossman, who leads loyalty efforts at eBay, discusses the early challenges the company faced as it adopted the Net Promoter System (2:30), the importance of building trust (13:20) and what it takes to become customer-centric (38:45).

Leela Srinivasan of restaurant reservation service OpenTable discusses the challenges of running a restaurant (8:10), shares key lessons from Net Promoter feedback (12:20) and talks about the company's mobile payment app (23:21).

Bain's Fred Reichheld returns to the podcast to share his early experiences with team huddles (1:50), the ways that companies use them to connect employees to the larger business mission (7:45), and tips to make them more effective (31:55).

Jeanne Bliss, who pioneered the role of chief customer officer, discusses the dangers of reactionary behavior (3:00), the traits of an effective chief customer officer (15:30) and the companies she admires (23:50).

Bonny Simi, vice president of talent at JetBlue, shares the airline's approach to inspiring employees (8:00), encouraging teamwork (10:45) and creating a culture that puts customers first (23:05).

Ann Goggins Gregory and Mark Andrews of Habitat for Humanity discuss their efforts to pilot the Net Promoter System with volunteers (9:27), the surprising clarity that open-ended questions can provide (16:00) and the complexities that come with running a major nonprofit (30:00).

Birchbox cofounder Hayley Barna discusses how the beauty e-commerce company got its start (3:02), how it rigorously tracks customer buying behavior (14:36) and its decision to open physical stores (27:46).

Telecom executive John Dwyer discusses the benefits of the Net Promoter System's outer loop process (13:45), the company's approach to delighting mobile customers (16:10) and its strategies for supporting frontline employees (27:09).

Former Disney executive Lee Cockerell shares what it takes to maintain high-quality service at the company's theme parks and resorts (4:52), anticipate customers' needs (16:41) and spread that signature Disney magic (26:52).

Alan Balmer and Fernando Cadena of Elwood Staffing discuss how they use Net Promoter to improve conditions for employees in temporary placements (18:34), build lasting relationships (35:28) and improve the staffing experience for clients (42:43).

Dave Gilboa, cofounder of the eyewear company Warby Parker, discusses his mission to change the way consumers buy glasses (5:20), the decision to open physical stores (18:56) and how the company uses Net Promoter to maintain a strong customer experience (32:11).

Bain Fellow Fred Reichheld discusses the risks of tying Net Promoter Scores to compensation (4:00), the consequences of gaming a feedback system (11:33) and what it takes to get to the true root cause of a complaint (17:49).

Jim Clark of the Steamboat Springs Chamber Resort Association and Rob Perlman of the Steamboat Ski and Resort Corporation discuss when led them to gauge visitor sentiment across their town (6:40), what they learned (12:10) and how they're improving the tourist experience (21:26).

Harry's cofounder Andy Katz-Mayfield discusses what inspired him to enter the razor market (4:40), his company's personal approach to customer service (21:23) and the challenges of building a customer-centric culture at a growing company (32:07).

Bain Fellow Fred Reichheld discusses the Net Promoter System's inner loop mechanism for collecting and sharing feedback (9:56), the qualities that make NPS popular worldwide (17:09) and the perils of using mystery shoppers (24:10).

Delighted CEO Caleb Elston discusses his company's Net Promoter origins (3:29), its minimalist approach to feedback (9:00) and how its clients use its software to understand customers (39:21).

Safelite AutoGlass CEO Tom Feeney discusses what it takes to make car repairs less painful (12:23), teach customer-centric behaviors to staff (18:14) and inspire cultural change (30:23).

Bain Partner Michael Mankins discusses what it takes to truly engage employees (8:59), tactics for managing star players (20:50) and the importance of inspirational leadership (26:17).

Gautam Mahtani of Customer Feedback Systems LP, along with Phil Fegan and Sarah Cooper of HealthCare Partners of Nevada, discuss their strategies for collecting patient feedback (4:24), addressing the unique needs of healthcare providers (29:28) and organizational changes designed to improve care (33:26).

Jennifer Cunningham of Cornell University and Linda Reed of Stanford discuss the crucial role of college alumni (16:33), how they use Net Promoter System to build loyalty (25:30) and their strategies for following up with detractors (46:59).

Satmetrix CEO Richard Owen discusses his company's approach to customer experience management (3:50), the use of social media as a feedback tool (22:30) and the future of surveys (29:10).

Omar Hashem, chief customer officer of the National Commercial Bank of Saudi Arabia, discusses his role as a customer advocate (9:35), the challenges he encounters (14:08) and the Net Promoter System's impact on his company (31:08).

Andrew MacPherson of the UK National Health Service talks about the organization's Friends and Family Test (15:12), the challenges of measuring customer service in healthcare (17:36) and what's next for its Net Promoter program (46:34).

Lori Cobb and Dave Crompton, executives at the engine maker Cummins, discuss their Net Promoter System efforts (11:40), the complexities of B2B markets (15:09) and what it takes to forge an outwardly focused culture (32:54).

Howard Behar, who spent almost two decades at Starbucks, discusses the importance of letting employees be themselves (9:41) and encouraging creativity (14:35), and the origins of the Frappuccino (27:47).

Chad Keck of Promoter.io discusses his experience with the Net Promoter System (4:02), his goals to simplify feedback collection (16:11) and what's next for his company (46:40).

Bain Fellow Fred Reichheld returns to the podcast to discuss the employee engagement tool he's developing (3:44), the power of teams (14:45) and the state of surveys (22:37).

Peter Fader, co-director of the Wharton Customer Analytics Initiative at the University of Pennsylvania, talks about using data to understand consumers (5:20), become more customer-centric (13:08) and target the most valuable customers (32:22).

Bain & Company Partner Gerard du Toit talks about the struggle banks face in attracting new customers (7:25), the companies that have made the biggest strides in service (23:32), and the importance of digital tools in fostering loyalty (31:14).

Horst Schulze, CEO of Capella Hotel Group and one of the founders of Ritz-Carlton, reflects on what it takes to set a high bar for service (7:34), engage employees (16:02) and earn customers' enduring loyalty (38:31).

Host Rob Markey and Herman Miller's Pam Carpenter talk about the challenges of enacting cultural change (8:31), the benefits of a customer advocacy office (15:56) and the company's process for choosing technology support for its Net Promoter efforts (31:20).

Amy Pressman, co-founder of Medallia, talks about the customer experience company's NPS work (5:46), the unique tactics of customer-centric companies (8:02) and the importance of sharing feedback with front-line employees (16:33).

Pam Carpenter and Michael Ramirez talk about the next steps in Herman Miller's NPS journey (3:16), the challenges of turning feedback into action (15:37) and lessons they've learned (36:35).

Adam Ramshaw, founder of Genroe, talks about common mistakes companies make when they adopt the Net Promoter System (11:28), his views on benchmarking (25:16) and how service companies are looking to manufacturing for new ways to improve performance (40:24).

Herman Miller's Pam Carpenter returns to the podcast to discuss the company's NPS pilot efforts (5:55), its response rates (16:04) and an experiment that's giving the company a window into the customer experience (34:59).

Tony Ezell, vice president of global market research at Eli Lilly & Co., discusses how trust (7:10) and a company's culture (21:22) play a role in developing loyalty, and the dangers of "invisible fence syndrome" (23:00).

Rob Markey talks to Humm CEO Bernard Briggs and Robert Irvine, host of the Food Network's Restaurant: Impossible, about Humm's customer service tools (11:30), the surprising lessons of real-time feedback (15:13) and what's next for the company (41:21).

Rob Markey talks to Ruth Veloria, executive dean of the University of Phoenix School of Business, about the unique challenges of a for-profit college (4:41), how it's using NPS to improve the student experience (7:23) and the benefits of real-time feedback (10:24).

Rob Markey checks back in with Herman Miller's Michael Ramirez and Pam Carpenter about how a small pilot had a big effect (5:06), the challenge of rallying employees to address a single complaint (6:30) and identifying the ROI of doing so (11:30), why middle-management needs those numbers (18:24) and how the economics vary by customer segment (36:00).

Richard Watts, who led the adoption of the Net Promoter System at Progressive, the insurance company, talks with Rob Markey about what led an analytical company to choose such a simple measure (4:22), challenges to adoption (7:44), how NPS became one of the company's key metrics (14:21) and what he would do differently if he had to do it all over again (29:22).

Borge Hald, founder and CEO of Medallia, explains how the company captures a wide variety of customer feedback and shares it with company employees (6:50), how Medallia got its start in the hotel business during a difficult time (8:15), the importance of company cultures that treasure feedback (28:28) and what he thinks the future of customer feedback will look like (41:25).

Mattersight CEO Kelly Conway talks with Rob Markey about algorithms that analyze customer calls in near-real time (5:52), implementing them in call centers (17:18), client success stories (34:17) and matching employees to your customers' predominant personality (38:48).

In part two of Rob's discussion with Linda Verba of TD Bank and Brian Andrews, formerly of Intuit, they talk about what happens in NPS Loyalty Forums and discuss the importance of senior leadership support for NPS initiatives (5:23), loyalty across a broad range of industries in Asia (8:23), the need to selectively tackle NPS opportunities (20:10) and a problem with pasta on a plane (28:30).

Linda Verba of TD Bank and Brian Andrews, formerly of Intuit, discuss the difference between Net Promoter Score and Net Promoter System (11:22), accountability within the system (22:41) and the importance of authentic, human employees (30:34).

Pam Carpenter talks about the office-furniture maker's NPS pilots (2:06), lessons about e-mail surveys (5:05), how to write effective feedback requests (13:28) and how to turn feedback into action (29:22).

Martha King discusses the firm's Net Promoter System journey (6:08), including recent pilots that aim to collect better touchpoint feedback (18:55). She also offers advice to others who are considering adopting the system (47:02).

Gillian Smith explains how the nonprofit uses the Net Promoter System to gauge its impact on schools it serves (10:04) and employee engagement (17:20). She also shares what she wishes she knew before she started using NPS (30:56).

Michael Ramirez and Pam Carpenter discuss how the office furniture maker approaches customer loyalty (10:35), gathers feedback (16:33) and turns scores into action (31:38).

Fred Reichheld talks about the challenges companies face in engaging employees (8:45), the question of linking NPS to compensation (18:05) and how Net Promoter can enhance innovation (30:15).